View Full Version : Bookbinder Queue
Why can i only make 1 Manuscript/Tome/Codex at the time.
Why not same method as by Provisionhouse and barrack, with a slice bar, how many i want to make.
Now i have to return every day back to the bookbinder to click on one of the buttons.
Please try to give as a solution for this.
People have been asking for a queue system on the test server. No response from BB
People have been asking for a queue system on the test server. No response from BB
Thats nothing new :)
Don't forget we get the Glue buffs for the Bookbinder tomorrow as well!
Don't forget we get the Glue buffs for the Bookbinder tomorrow as well!
Thats true, but only , we cant make them and we cant buy them in shop, only tradeable.
Myeah the bookbinder really needs a queue, this is just silly. I'd rather have longer production times with a queue than this current system.
Benedicter
13.06.13, 18:03
Don't forget we get the Glue buffs for the Bookbinder tomorrow as well!
lol, i admire your loyalty peck_ed :P
Also, whose idea was it to make the production for the smiths and mills so fast that you don't really need to upgrade any of the buildings because of the slow speed of the bookbinder (even when it's at level 5)? Not that it's a huge issue because you save a lot of resources by not needing to upgrade or purchase several buildings but still, what's the point?
Also, whose idea was it to make the production for the smiths and mills so fast that you don't really need to upgrade any of the buildings because of the slow speed of the bookbinder (even when it's at level 5)? Not that it's a huge issue because you save a lot of resources by not needing to upgrade or purchase several buildings but still, what's the point?
Jackster, have you looked at it carefully on the live version? The paper/etc buildings have been slowed down A LOT! I don't think what you say is true any more.
Duong_TonThat
14.06.13, 01:10
Jackster was right, even with the live version you don't really need to upgrade any of the buildings
calculate is here: http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/24285-Recommend-Resource%E2%80%99s-Building-LEVEL-for-Bookbinder
The only reason right now to upgrade the buildings would be if you wanted to make a business out of it and sell the goods but again, who would want to buy them when there will be a major surplus all the time (except for right now when the system has just been implemented)? My prediction is that Nibs and such will soon be almost worthless rubbish on the market.
widowmaker1985
14.06.13, 08:02
Even if that's the case (which I believe it is), any excess can be sold. I'm sure there are plenty of higher levels who arent going to worry about finding the 6 spots for the production buildings and will just buy the materials off the TO.
It's kind of a win/win at the moment imho
stefanceltare
14.06.13, 08:10
One quick example:
a lvl 5 book binder will need 250 simple paper per 12h
I have a lvl 4 simple paper which makes 248 / 12h
For me thats enough with a buff but any lower lvl than that and you wouldn't have enough. Numbers have been changed from the test version to live.
a lvl 5 binder needs 200 nibs
I have a lvl 4 finesmith making 184 / 12h
Again, as you see I'd need to buff or build a second one to have the minimum.
Duong_TonThat
14.06.13, 08:51
One quick example:
a lvl 5 book binder will need 250 simple paper per 12h
I have a lvl 4 simple paper which makes 248 / 12h
For me thats enough with a buff but any lower lvl than that and you wouldn't have enough. Numbers have been changed from the test version to live.
a lvl 5 binder needs 200 nibs
I have a lvl 4 finesmith making 184 / 12h
Again, as you see I'd need to buff or build a second one to have the minimum.
u only making script what about tome and codex. R u going to make them? If u do then u the calculation is diffrent
stefanceltare
14.06.13, 10:56
The same applies for the other mats needed in tomes and codex and yes i will only make manuscripts for quite a while seeing how you need 1 manuscript for the second book. The point was that numbers have been changed and if you dont upgrade those production buildings you don't have enough in any way you wanna put it...
Why can i only make 1 Manuscript/Tome/Codex at the time.
Why not same method as by Provisionhouse and barrack, with a slice bar, how many i want to make.
Now i have to return every day back to the bookbinder to click on one of the buttons.
Please try to give as a solution for this.
Do you really need a queue for something that takes a day to complete at the minimum? I'm not sure that it's such a hardship to click one button every day....
Do you really need a queue for something that takes a day to complete at the minimum? I'm not sure that it's such a hardship to click one button every day....
The problem is the dead time.
At level 4, a manuscript takes 15 hours. Let's say you log in at 9am to start one going. It will finish at midnight. Now maybe you'll be up at midnight, but if not you've just lost 9 hours of available production time until you log in again at 9am. This makes the upgrade from level 3 to 4 was worthless unless you manage to log in at two very specific times of the day each day.
The problem is the dead time.
At level 4, a manuscript takes 15 hours. Let's say you log in at 9am to start one going. It will finish at midnight. Now maybe you'll be up at midnight, but if not you've just lost 9 hours of available production time until you log in again at 9am. This makes the upgrade from level 3 to 4 was worthless unless you manage to log in at two very specific times of the day each day.
Okay, make the queue a gem option. What's your comment now?
stefanceltare
14.06.13, 13:27
Okay, make the queue a gem option. What's your comment now?
Your comment is not constructive... Why make it a gem option? Can you also give an argument?
Both PH and barrack have a queue with the possibility to speed production with gems. That system works just fine so it would seem logic to be the same. For all intent and purpose, the book binder is just like the provision house.
You could argue the same for buffing, why not be able to stack them? Part of the challenge for me is crafting up a well timed schedule for it all, sometimes produce the Codex as it'll help resync it to the time you're online and then use the Manuscript to reduce the time for other books.
Same with buffs, I use Solid Sandwiches when I'm active during the day and the Baskets when I go out to work or sleep.
Your comment is not constructive... Why make it a gem option? Can you also give an argument?
Both PH and barrack have a queue with the possibility to speed production with gems. That system works just fine so it would seem logic to be the same. For all intent and purpose, the book binder is just like the provision house.
Yes I can - books take a long time to make. You can manage to click one button every so often to start another one going. If you want to benefit from 'dead time' between books, then maybe you should pay for it in gems. After all, it's going to cost BB money to program that in....
stefanceltare
14.06.13, 13:41
Stacking buffs /= a queue for the Book Binder. YOU can queue what you like and how you like ur buffs in the PH. Should be the same here
Yes I can - books take a long time to make. You can manage to click one button every so often to start another one going. If you want to benefit from 'dead time' between books, then maybe you should pay for it in gems. After all, it's going to cost BB money to program that in....
You must be joking, right? Do you have any idea what you're talking about? The coding is right there, no need to code anything, just look at your PH.
I'm not joking, I'm serious. Okay, I can't comment effectively on the work required to implement this change, but I'm not sure that you can either. I believe it only takes one click every so often to produce a book and a certain amount of time management to reduce 'dead time' between books. If you want more efficient production there are two options provided already:
1. Use gems to produce a book instantly.
2. Use the glue buffs to double the production of the bookbinder.
If you also want a third option, namely a production queue, then why should that not also cost gems? Why should it be free?
stefanceltare
14.06.13, 15:16
If you also want a third option, namely a production queue, then why should that not also cost gems? Why should it be free?
Because there is already the choice of instant production with gems so whoever wants insta books can buy them. PH/Barrack have same system and it works just fine. Why use this gimmick with no queue... whats the logic behind it?
Unless I'm very much mistaken, it doesn't take 20 hours to make one army unit, or one tool. Also, the Bookbinder makes books that are to be used for the skills trees and may be part of a different system. I don't see the Bookbinder as being the same as the PH or Barracks, so I don't expect to have a queue for it. I understand you have a different point of view on that.
I don't know why the Bookbinder is set up in this particular way, but I don't find it a problem. Not all buildings work in the same way anyway.
widowmaker1985
16.06.13, 00:14
Because there is already the choice of instant production with gems so whoever wants insta books can buy them. PH/Barrack have same system and it works just fine. Why use this gimmick with no queue... whats the logic behind it?
Using the same logic you should be able to queue Explorers as well.
So fatman, when you come back, unload your stuff and go straight back out on an adventure search!
Are you complaining about having to log in every 12 hours for explorers? If you aren't then get your bookbinder to level 5 and then you can work on the same schedule (12h cycle for manuscripts at level 5)...
stefanceltare
16.06.13, 03:53
Using the same logic you should be able to queue Explorers as well.
So fatman, when you come back, unload your stuff and go straight back out on an adventure search!
Are you complaining about having to log in every 12 hours for explorers? If you aren't then get your bookbinder to level 5 and then you can work on the same schedule (12h cycle for manuscripts at level 5)...
Your logic is not my logic... The book binder is a building, the explorer is not, it's a different game mechanic. And what same schedule are you talking about? Explorers can be sent on both adventure searches and treasures which personally I combine. Obviously you're comparing apples with pears but I wont go there...
Making some observations or pointing how a system can be made better does not make one a complainer... Am logging 10 times a day or am online for hours at a time so that is not the point. The point is that having a queue makes it simple and simple is better, PH and barracks have proven that. Would you want to remove the queue from those 2 buildings as well? Why am I relating to those 2 buildings? For one, they share the same upgrading costs. All 3 are not production yards, all use resources to magically make items over periods of time and all 3 have an interface to work with. That pretty much tells me the book binder is in the same category as the PH & Barrack.
One more thing. I am upgrading my book binder to lvl 5 but go tell that to the rest of the players... the majority cannot afford a lvl 5 upgrade. Even my PH/barrack are not lvl 5. Don't be one sided... would it bother you if the building had a queue?
Enough said on this topic I guess, time to choke, nudge my head and walk away...
widowmaker1985
16.06.13, 04:26
Your logic is not my logic...
Perhaps... But then judging from the comments on this thread, your logic isn't anyones logic... Anyone who agrees with you is staying particularly quiet.
I have no issue with how the bookbinder works and I would disagree that because one is a specialist and one is a building they can't have the same mechanic. Also as someone said previously, the production time has a lot to do with whether items can be queued. A single basket or recruit (or even a "stack" of 25) is hardly a long production queue. Even at level 5, the quickest production is 12 hours for the bookbinder.
If it makes you feel any better, think of the bookbinder like a specialist and you will be able to sleep easier at night. I treat it as another Explorer/Geo that I have to task to do something every x hours. I have read this post through a few times now and I still don't understand why you would be upset with them implementing it this way but have no problem with the Explorer mechanics. Even if they are a building not a specialist- why can they not share the same mechanic even if they are "apples and pearls" as you would say?
I think this has already been mentioned but thought I'd raise it again with my main concern which is without a queue the demand for science supplies in TO will quickly die off completely. Without a queue, even low level science buildings are enough for a player as their book binder will have a fairly large down time.
As another thought - perhaps trained specialists could require on-going training to keep them fresh. If they were not kept current their skills would stop working (not be lost though) until training resumed. Specialists could require something low such as a book every week or two and could use up a book relating to their highest skill so one trained using manuscripts would require a manuscript, ones trained with tomes would require a tome etc...
This would obviously require adjusted bookbinder building times and further thought but it would provide an on-going demand for science supplies. To build a whole bunch of highly trained specialists and keep them trained would require either a reasonable science industry or the purchase of relevant science supplies from TO. Would definitely encourage more investment in science supply chains and increase trade in science supplies.
stefanceltare
16.06.13, 07:29
Anyone who agrees stays quiet because it has been proven on several occasions that BB does not listen to the player's feedback.
I am not upset but annoyed because it is yet another item on the daily to-do list in this game but as it is now i have to do it 2 times at specific hours with no control whatsoever. So if I am not online for one evening then thats it... the binder does not work. Sometimes when I am at work I cannot log early in the morning. That means my book gathering hours and putting the next one will fluctuate. Say if I put one at 12PM then that means at Midnight I have to put the next. Do you see my problem?
A game is meant to be fun and not tedious.
I agree with the use of a queue system in the bookbinder, but do not agree with anything else. It will take a long time to get each individual geologist up the tree or part way. I do not think that at this moment anything needs changing except putting a queue system in place, even if you upped the gold required for the manuscript from 10 for 1st level, 20 for 2nd level, etc. Or put in place some challenge to get an extra queue slot, either by purchase through gems or through guild coins. Just an idea.
There will be science systems for explorers, military and home island added too, so the various books (and associated production materials) will always be in demand.
As to the queue, though it would be a good idea, balancing a production timeline like
Part of the challenge for me is crafting up a well timed schedule for it all, sometimes produce the Codex as it'll help resync it to the time you're online and then use the Manuscript to reduce the time for other books.said, is part of the idiosyncrasy of this new feature.
A game is only part of life, some of us have more important things to worry about than ensuring something is happening in game 24/7.
Anyone who agrees stays quiet because it has been proven on several occasions that BB does not listen to the player's feedback.
I am not upset but annoyed because it is yet another item on the daily to-do list in this game but as it is now i have to do it 2 times at specific hours with no control whatsoever. So if I am not online for one evening then thats it... the binder does not work. Sometimes when I am at work I cannot log early in the morning. That means my book gathering hours and putting the next one will fluctuate. Say if I put one at 12PM then that means at Midnight I have to put the next. Do you see my problem?
A game is meant to be fun and not tedious.
If you think the game is tedious and not fun then you should stop playing ;)
Logic is irrelevant. There's very little logic to this game and essentially none to the way the science system has been set up.
If BB were after consistency with every other building in the game, they would have put a queue in the bookbinder since every other building can be either queued up or keeps on producing automatically. There is no building like the bookbinder in the game which just stops after one cycle.
For whatever reason they didn't decide to do that. And there are plenty of people who think that is a bad decision.
What reasons might they have to not put a queue on the bookbinder?
1. To limit the number of books people have
Why? They're not tradeable. The bookbinder is already way too slow compared to the buildings that produce resources for it. Why would they want to slow up the bookbinder further?
2. To make people pay with gems.
People already can pay with gems to insta-buy a book. Is a queue really going to make people less likely to insta-buy? Completely different thought processes.
3. Didn't think of it in rushing the science system through and couldn't be bothered to change the design after everyone on test told them it was a much needed feature
Hmm.... if you want evidence of other rushed design aspects to the bookbinder, how about the fact that the production bar covers up half the window so you can't see the production requirements! Also the fact that IT DIDN'T WORK for the first few days it was on the test server!
4. To force people to plan ahead.
Ha! Don't make me laugh. Does anyone actually think that idea was fed into the design process when choosing the production times for the bookbinder? They just decided they wanted it to be slow and plucked the exact figures from thin air. That's certainly what they did for the associated production buildings. Don't mistake an unintended consequence of a feature for a design aspect.
I vote for number 3
stefanceltare
16.06.13, 17:38
If you think the game is tedious and not fun then you should stop playing ;)
If you have nothing to add to the discussion at hand maybe you should stop posting...
I vote for number 3
I don't think it's 3... Code wise they would've copy pasted the PH code.
I vote for a combination of 1 and your reasoning for 4.
" They just decided they wanted it to be slow and plucked the exact figures from thin air and no queue, lets see how that works out."
A game is only part of life, some of us have more important things to worry about than ensuring something is happening in game 24/7.
Probably the single most intelligent thing I have read on these boards for a long time.
I mean come on... raising the quantities needed is one thing but not being able to have a queue is just sadistic...
There will be science systems for explorers, military and home island added too, so the various books (and associated production materials) will always be in demand.
As to the queue, though it would be a good idea, balancing a production timeline like said, is part of the idiosyncrasy of this new feature.
Sadly not the case. As I mentioned, because the bookbinder is so slow a single building, un-buffed, is able to produce enough mats for one person to run their binder. There will be no significant TO demand unless peoples demand potentially outstrips their supply of the science materials.
And to elliea's point. It wont take a long time at all. It'll take under 1 month per geologist.
And to elliea's point. It wont take a long time at all. It'll take under 1 month per geologist.
Lvl 5 bookbinder: 31 manuscripts, 21 tomes, 11 codices = roughly 36 days presuming no gaps in the production cycle between books.
You should also note that quite a few of the high level, full island players have chosen not to build the material production buildings and therefore will always need to buy from Trade Office.
Remember too, that there is quite a large supply of bookbinder glue at the moment, which would increase support material demand. Let's hope BB somehow make this item purchasable/find-able in the future.
Finally: If you find the cost of support materials in Trade Office makes it ineffective to run a support building... demolish it and start buying instead (same as bowmaker, same as iron production, same as every other production building in the game)
Alternatively, just zZzleep it occasionally and maybe run it buffed during woken times.
I actually think BB have found quite sensible production cycle times in the science system, allowing individual players to choose which method suits them best.
(p.s. I do have all the buildings (pending 3.5k granite for the last one, upgraded to lvls 3, 2 and 1 respectively) and will be keeping an eye on trade prices to determine whether I should keep them, upgrade them or just demolish them)
I now find myself wondering why you have to collect a book once it's printed, a completely new mechanic from all other production processes in game which either deliver straight to star or store. It's almost as if the coder wanted everyone to say "Oh what an amazing piece of coding". Sorry it's a Kudos fail.
I'm talking about on-going demand. The current system has a finite amount of demand that will taper off in several months. For other products BB have found ways to create an on-going demand such as the way they craft adventures to ensure at some point most troop types get lost. This is merely a way to ensure that the science products have longevity and maintain demand as time goes on.
You mention longbows as a product where no-one bothers to make them. They are the perfect way to prove my point. There is a very limited demand for them as people quickly move to crossbows for damage and standard bowmen for cannon fodder. As such they are cheap as chips and no-one uses them. That is the ultimate end of the science products without some mechanism to create lasting demand.
I think on-going training is a good way to do it but there will definitely be other ways. Perhaps if training isn't something people like someone could throw out other suggestions.
I know at some point other skill trees will be introduced but they would ultimately suffer the same long term outcome. Seems better to come up with some sort of economic sink rather than having to release another skill tree every 3 months.
Juhana_III
18.06.13, 12:34
I'm talking about on-going demand. The current system has a finite amount of demand that will taper off in several months.
I don't see a problem with this. I'll just produce my stock full of the book-making items and then demolish the buildings.
Of course it'd make more sense if there was a longer-term demand for them and if they were produced a little slower (so they'd have some trade value). But I don't see this as a critical problem in the game that absolutely needs to be fixed.
I also think that this new mechanic ist not a good choice for the bookbinder - it creates a bottleneck ( maybe that was the idea so to lower the book production) that makes upgrading the new building almost pointless - it will be be better if they make it like the Provision House and the Barracks. BB can always trow - new skills and/or make the production time of the books longer to balance the issue.
As another thought - perhaps trained specialists could require on-going training to keep them fresh. If they were not kept current their skills would stop working (not be lost though) until training resumed. Specialists could require something low such as a book every week or two and could use up a book relating to their highest skill so one trained using manuscripts would require a manuscript, ones trained with tomes would require a tome etc...
Please don't include ongoing training of specialists. In order to produce the 31 books needed to fully train one geologist to the top of the skill tree it takes:
Level 1 - 179 days
Level 2 - 89 days 12 hours
Level 3 - 59 days 16 hours
Level 4 - 44 days 18 hours
Level 5 - 35 days 19 hours 12 minutes
That is only the book production time, not including time for production of materials or upgrades or anything else. It takes 3 days 12 hours to make one manuscript with a level 1 bookbinder - if the geologist loses one skill point every week or two it will take half a week to regain that point.
I think with these times there will be an ongoing demand for science supplies anyway. Most people have more than one geologist...
A game is only part of life, some of us have more important things to worry about than ensuring something is happening in game 24/7.
Agreed - I don't lose any sleep about the fact that my production is not optimized over 24/7/365. If I miss some hours of production, buffing or other stuff then it's not really that important. If you do find it that important then spend a bit of time working out what will be convenient for your schedule. Or change your schedule around the game.
But I don't see this as a critical problem in the game that absolutely needs to be fixed.
Definitely not a critical problem - just a suggestion.
That is only the book production time, not including time for production of materials or upgrades or anything else. It takes 3 days 12 hours to make one manuscript with a level 1 bookbinder - if the geologist loses one skill point every week or two it will take half a week to regain that point.
A) No-one will keep a lvl 1 bookbinder
B) The mats are concurrently so there is no added time for those
Besides, don't get stuck on the orinage example of 'a book a week'. It was just an example and acknowledged that changes would be needed (either in the idea or bookbinder production times)
The main point is that science supplies should have an economic sink of some kind to create on-going demand.
+1 - a queue or a proper notification when the run completes is essential.
There will be science systems for explorers, military and home island added too.
So, let's say 36 days per specialist...
Geologists: 6 Jolly, 3 Normal
Explorers: 5 Savage, 3 Normal
Military (if based on generals): 2 BHG, 2 Vet, 4 Norm
Home Island: Let's just call that 1
So, over 2 years worth of book production for me and I know many players use a lot more specialists than I do.
Surely that is ongoing demand.
So, let's say 36 days per specialist...
Geologists: 6 Jolly, 3 Normal
Explorers: 5 Savage, 3 Normal
Military (if based on generals): 2 BHG, 2 Vet, 4 Norm
Home Island: Let's just call that 1
So, over 2 years worth of book production for me and I know many players use a lot more specialists than I do.
Surely that is ongoing demand.
You are definitely not an average punter. That is far more specialists than an average person would have.
You are definitely not an average punter. That is far more specialists than an average person would have.
No it isn't
A queue would be much better than the current solution. Steering toward a gameplay where you have to set timers for when to be online is bad IMO, and having a building that can produce 1.5 resource a day, but only produce 1 due to no queue is fustrating.
(Would rather not see the rest of the suggestions in first post implemented)
As long as people are willing to sell a item there will be people willing to buy instead of producing themselves. Also as the game stands nobody has a guaranteed influx of exoticwood logs and titanium ore, therefore there exists a chance of a shortfall which will prevent you producing what you need for your next book. In that situation you have 2 choices, either wait or buy from trade. A majority will buy. After a while you may find you have excess of the lower level items, as always you will try to trade that excess for something you need, especially as the returns from paper and nibs is far higher than the returns from pine wood logs and water.
You should all take a look at the increased cost for producing tome/codex here:
http://forum.tsotesting.com/threads/18839-Books-cost-increase
In the end you're going to need 180 (193 for lvl50) books per specialist. Even at lvl5 bookbinder that'll take 90-100 days. So lets say 3 specialists/year.
You should all take a look at the increased cost for producing tome/codex here:
http://forum.tsotesting.com/threads/18839-Books-cost-increase
In the end you're going to need 180 (193 for lvl50) books per specialist. Even at lvl5 bookbinder that'll take 90-100 days. So lets say 3 specialists/year.
How many more a year are you intending to buy ?
How many more a year are you intending to buy ?
I got 22 at the moment, disregarding that the first 6 are a bit cheaper that's more then 7 years of non-stop bookbinder production (also disregarding glue). Doubt this game is even around by then. I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I'm just stating facts.
On the test server, the incremental prices originally began only for books stored in storehouses. This seemed a good idea to stop people stockpiling them ready for military and other skill lines.
This current escalation of costs seems rather disproportional to the rewards of having skills.
I would pay 1000 gems to have a queue length of 2 in the book binder; when one book ends the next starts automatically and I can just add a new book to the queue whenever.
1000 gems, maybe more.
The current solution for the bookbinder is inefficient.
Most of the time, the bookbinder finishes a manuscript when you are not logged on.
This makes the bookbinder inactive while papermill and finesmith keep working. Upgrading the bookbinder only makes it worse.
End result is huge amounts of paper and nib in your storage houses.
I suggest therefore a bookbinder that keeps working; perhaps by a queueing mechanism, just like the provision house?
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 19:40
Some of us kept saying that for quite some time... Doesn't look like they're willing to listen...
It's true that it results in downtime, but it is clearly deliberate. Why? No one seems to know so far. It is very clearly deliberate though.
My only advice is this... chill. :) It's only a few minutes or a couple of hours lost each time and it's not that critical to playing the game. With minor annoyances like this the best thing is just to accept it and not worry, particularly because it is the same for us all. So far BB have not responded to feedback by promising a fix, so this may be how it will be always.
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 20:05
I would call it critical to the Science system... Isn't it enough that it takes hours to make a book and quite some resources to make those books? Those buildings which produce materials for the books are really hefty in terms of needs. Even at max lvl a binder will still take 12 full hours to make so by definition i'd call that SLOW.
But that is not enough and BB cripples us with a no queue for the binder... which not only makes for a mess when it comes to schedules but also frustration.
@Bob Is not only minutes, or a couple hours... it can also be long hours if your production time happens to finish around 1AM or those odd times.
Come on, there's a big company outthere that was imposing stupid restrictions in his product but the public fought back and that company toke back those measures.
What i mean is, BB, you just have to make possible a simple queue which i dont think is that difficult... people just need to complain and we might get 0,1% of getting that option available.
As far as i know, its the only building without queue in game... is there a reason in first place for it? Because if there is one, i dont think it was explained nor i think it will ever be...
I would call it critical to the Science system... Isn't it enough that it takes hours to make a book and quite some resources to make those books? Those buildings which produce materials for the books are really hefty in terms of needs. Even at max lvl a binder will still take 12 full hours to make so by definition i'd call that SLOW.
But that is not enough and BB cripples us with a no queue for the binder... which not only makes for a mess when it comes to schedules but also frustration.
@Bob Is not only minutes, or a couple hours... it can also be long hours if your production time happens to finish around 1AM or those odd times.
It's the same for everyone though. I'm not saying it's good, I'm just saying it's really not worth getting worked up about.
I do understand that a lot of players have been drawn into Settlers to play in the 'most efficient' way - maximising production routes and so on - but if one steps back and looks at the whole process, then losing book production time (which ALL players will) just isn't important. For example... if it takes months to fully upgrade all your geos (and it will), are you really that bothered if someone else manages to do it a couple of days quicker because they stayed up more? Really? Fair enough if that matters to you, but I can't see that it's a big deal for many. No offence meant - we all play the game the way we want to and that's important - but on this issue I just can't see that it makes much difference. To put it in perspective, I'm more bothered about the resetting geo bug still existing than I am about this.
Edit to add: Do you make sure your explorers don't spend a minute idle in searching for adventures or treasure? It's the same thing. There's no way to queue explorer searches, but I don't see anyone going mad about that. I repeat, I'm not saying the lack of a queue is good, I'm just trying to add some perspective.
It's the same for everyone though. I'm not saying it's good, I'm just saying it's really not worth getting worked up about.
I do understand that a lot of players have been drawn into Settlers to play in the 'most efficient' way - maximising production routes and so on - but if one steps back and looks at the whole process, then losing book production time (which ALL players will) just isn't important. For example... if it takes months to fully upgrade all your geos (and it will), are you really that bothered if someone else manages to do it a couple of days quicker because they stayed up more? Really? Fair enough if that matters to you, but I can't see that it's a big deal for many. No offence meant - we all play the game the way we want to and that's important - but on this issue I just can't see that it makes much difference. To put it in perspective, I'm more bothered about the resetting geo bug still existing than I am about this.
Edit to add: Do you make sure your explorers don't spend a minute idle in searching for adventures or treasure? It's the same thing. There's no way to queue explorer searches, but I don't see anyone going mad about that. I repeat, I'm not saying the lack of a queue is good, I'm just trying to add some perspective.
Agreed, Is it a perfect system? nope... Does it NEED to be? not really. Its just a game I'm happy to roll with it.
Am I the confused one now? I'm making a suggestion to improve the game - just like BB asks us to do - and all of a sudden there are several players stating that it's not so important.
Yes, I know that. That's not the point of making a suggestion though...
Your suggestion is a good one, I wouldn't dare say different. I just feel sorry for BB sometimes as it seems they getting a bashing from all angles on just about everything xD... I like to cut them some slack really as I do think they do a good job and must feel they can do no right (as a worker) that must really suck lol !!
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:00
@BobLurker We can't play the game the way we want when there is no flexibility in the system. I don't give a "penny" on how fast other people skill their geos... that is not the point. The point is that current system is not satisfactory, far from it.
It's also a bit silly to compare producing books to sending explorers, don't you think? I couldn't care less if i got x map fragments an hour later, 5 or 10 hours later but I do care when my binder is idle for 8-9 hours knowing that it takes months, as you pointed out, to skill 1 petty geologist.
You can't see that being an issue for many? Then you're not looking good enough. As far as am concerned, there is no need for some perspective. Why should BB dumb this system down on purpose and expect me to be happy with it? If the system works for you then fine, no comment but is not for me and obviously am not the only one.
@Brayarg Thats such a pointless comment. "Does it NEED to be?" Yes, if it can be made better why not? It's just a game, not a second rl job.
Am I the confused one now? I'm making a suggestion to improve the game - just like BB asks us to do - and all of a sudden there are several players stating that it's not so important.
Yes, I know that. That's not the point of making a suggestion though...
You are absolutely right to make suggestions. :) You posted this in the 'General discussion' forum though, so I was discussing it. I wouldn't have posted the same thing in 'Game suggestions'.
@BobLurker We can't play the game the way we want when there is no flexibility in the system. I don't give a "penny" on how fast other people skill their geos... that is not the point. The point is that current system is not satisfactory, far from it.
It's also a bit silly to compare producing books to sending explorers, don't you think? I couldn't care less if i got x map fragments an hour later, 5 or 10 hours later but I do care when my binder is idle for 8-9 hours knowing that it takes months, as you pointed out, to skill 1 petty geologist.
You can't see that being an issue for many? Then you're not looking good enough. As far as am concerned, there is no need for some perspective. Why should BB dumb this system down on purpose and expect me to be happy with it? If the system works for you then fine, no comment but is not for me and obviously am not the only one.
@Brayarg Thats such a pointless comment. "Does it NEED to be?" Yes, if it can be made better why not? It's just a game, not a second rl job.
Pointless in your opinion? correct, but who is to say your opinion is the correct one? Is mine opinion worth less than yours? I am entitled to one and its just as valid as yours and I reserve the right to express is within the rules where I choose to!
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:12
Pointless in your opinion? correct, but who is to say your opinion is the correct one? Is mine opinion worth less than yours? I am entitled to one and its just as valid as yours and I reserve the right to express is within the rules where I choose to!
Yep, In my opinion. Ofc nobody has to say it's the correct one but at least am trying to support an idea on how to improve the system whereas you want it to stay the same because YOU have no problem with it and at the same time give no "penny" about other person's opinion.
It's also a bit silly to compare producing books to sending explorers, don't you think? I couldn't care less if i got x map fragments an hour later, 5 or 10 hours later but I do care when my binder is idle for 8-9 hours knowing that it takes months, as you pointed out, to skill 1 petty geologist.
If a geologist is 'petty', then all the more reason why it shouldn't be upsetting you so much. It really isn't silly to compare an explorer with the bookbinder. Explorers bring back extremely valuable items - a Black Knights or Nords is worth a huge amount to a player - and losing many hours search time over a year could mean losing many valuable advs. It really is the same basic thing as the bookbinder.
Try looking at it a different way. We are all puzzled as to why there isn't a queueing system for the bookbinder, but what are you actually losing as a result? It's the same for all of us, so you're not losing out to other players, so what are you losing out on? Look at it that way and maybe it will make things clearer.
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:23
If a geologist is 'petty', then all the more reason why it shouldn't be upsetting you so much. It really isn't silly to compare an explorer with the bookbinder. Explorers bring back extremely valuable items - a Black Knights or Nords is worth a huge amount to a player - and losing many hours search time over a year could mean losing many valuable advs. It really is the same basic thing as the bookbinder.
Try looking at it a different way. We are all puzzled as to why there isn't a queueing system for the bookbinder, but what are you actually losing as a result? It's the same for all of us, so you're not losing out to other players, so what are you losing out on? Look at it that way and maybe it will make things clearer.
I really don't understand what other players have to do with this... This is not a competition you know. It is about having an efficient island and an efficient Book Binder considering the slowness and costs of the books as a whole. It's okay that it is slow but it doesn't have to be flawed.
Explorers bringing Nords and BK? That's really laughable and funny that you pick those 2 specific advents considering the very low percentage they have. It's mostly Secluded and Sons and that takes a whooping 1 day (fast) or 2 days time which give no trouble.
Yep, In my opinion. Ofc nobody has to say it's the correct one but at least am trying to support an idea on how to improve the system whereas you want it to stay the same because YOU have no problem with it and at the same time give no "penny" about other person's opinion.
For one the idea isn't even in the suggestion forum. Its in general, so this is just an informal chat on said topic. I actually stated I was happy to roll with it, not that I had a preference either way. So maybe you should get your facts straight " you want it to stay the same" I said this when?? that's what I thought!!! I didn't, So don't twist things to suit your cause!
I give no time to any other person opinion?? really? Oh wait whats this I typed on the previous page?? "Your suggestion is a good one, I wouldn't dare say different" Bob is correct IMO it is an imperfect system, but its one that doesn't really need to be blown out of proportion.
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:29
Agreed, Is it a perfect system? nope... Does it NEED to be? not really. Its just a game I'm happy to roll with it.
This proves my point. If it's not perfect then the more reason to have a discussion about it. If there's room for improvement then by all means it should be.
This proves my point. If it's not perfect then the more reason to have a discussion about it. If there's room for improvement then by all means it should be.
There is a difference between a discussion and telling people their comments are worthless. You strive for perfection? I'm happy to just roll the dice and see where that takes me. Maybe you could try to make your case without the need to be aggressive and rude.
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:44
There is a difference between a discussion and telling people their comments are worthless. You strive for perfection? I'm happy to just roll the dice and see where that takes me. Maybe you could try to make your case without the need to be aggressive and rude.
You know what they say... if you have nothing constructive to add to a discussion, better move along. And honestly thats how i see that specific comment... That is not rude nor aggressive and am sorry if you feel that way. I do not strive for perfection but I find the whole science system to be incomplete at the moment and especially the Book Binder.
You know what they say... if you have nothing constructive to add to a discussion, better move along. And honestly thats how i see that specific comment... That is not rude nor aggressive and am sorry if you feel that way. I do not strive for perfection but I find the whole science system to be incomplete at the moment and especially the Book Binder.
Rather than keep on commenting over this and getting no where, moving on. Its not that this is a bad idea, far from it. There are just other things I believe should take priority over this. I don't feel strongly enough about either way to care much about it, It is what it is, Life goes on!
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 22:56
As far as I'm aware caps is considered shouting? for example " because YOU have " that is shouting directly at someone, rude much? My first comment was aimed at Bob's comment for people blowing it out of perspective, not if the idea was a good one or not. Maybe you should think before charging in like a bull in a china shop.
Seems to me like you're the one being rude. Nobody's shouting at you through the screen, unless you're playing hard core rock. Do you really have to derail this topic? If you have more of those insults i suggest you take it to PM without trolling this thread. It's a genuine discussion.
Seems to me like you're the one being rude. Nobody's shouting at you through the screen, unless you're playing hard core rock. Do you really have to derail this topic? If you have more of those insults i suggest you take it to PM without trolling this thread. It's a genuine discussion.
Down to perspective and yours seems to be a very narrow one.
I really don't understand what other players have to do with this... This is not a competition you know. It is about having an efficient island and an efficient Book Binder considering the slowness and costs of the books as a whole. It's okay that it is slow but it doesn't have to be flawed.
Explorers bringing Nords and BK? That's really laughable and funny that you pick those 2 specific advents considering the very low percentage they have. It's mostly Secluded and Sons and that takes a whooping 1 day (fast) or 2 days time which give no trouble.
I have been playing computer games for over 30 years - it has always been about competition. :) Competing with the computer, with myself and with others. It seems you are most interested in being efficient, which I referred to earlier, and that's fine, it's one of the ways Settlers set itself up, so they have to deal with the consequences. Clearly this matter aggravates you a lot, but a straw poll of my guild suggests it's low down on people's priority list. Each to their own.
The point of picking the two most valuable adventures to play was to point out how explorers can be very valuable and therefore a parallel to the bookbinder. You poured scorn on the suggestion that the two were comparable, but they clearly are. Take a moment to reconsider why you aren't at all bothered by downtime for your explorers, but you are so wound up by downtime for the bookbinder. If you're bothered by one, you ought to be bothered by the other. It's all about perspective.
stefanceltare
24.06.13, 23:24
Take a moment to reconsider why you aren't at all bothered by downtime for your explorers, but you are so wound up by downtime for the bookbinder. If you're bothered by one, you ought to be bothered by the other. It's all about perspective.
You see, this new science system is a new feature coming after such a gap of content release. Is not only far from perfect, it is a waste... just look a few threads lower in this forum section. It looks to me that thought hasn't been given thoroughly to this implementation. If the implementation was not so poor maybe your guild mates would give it a higher priority.
I am only bothered because BB deliberately chose to dumb it down while also restricting my play style when it comes to this new feature. What is the point of adding in it in the first place if players are unlikely to bother with it or give it low priority, like you said about ur guild?
It looks to me that thought hasn't been given thoroughly to this implementation.
As I said earlier though, it clearly is not accidental, it is deliberate. This isn't a bug that has slipped through. It was pointed out on the test server too. It is deliberate by the devs. By all means tell them you don't like it and why, but you must see that this is not accidental.
What is the point of adding in it in the first place if players are unlikely to bother with it or give it low priority, like you said about ur guild?
You misunderstand. Having a production queue at the bookbinder is low priority, not the science system itself. You need to separate the two things.
As you can see from the relative lack of interest in this thread, this just isn't something that most players care about. Indeed, I've spent enough time on it myself now! :) Hope I've made things clear to you now. :)
Lol, two guys fighting for 13 hours straight over a good and valid game suggestion. If you don't see the fun in that, then I don't know what's funny anymore :)
I'm not playing games for 30 years yet, but I do know that the difference between a good game and a great game is in the details.
Since I want this to be a great game: +1
MizMoneyPenny
26.06.13, 04:52
Think logically guys...... In time we may get a building cue, but i think the reason we don't atm is to slow us down, Those who are at higher levels can lvl our buildings up faster therefor make more resources that we can put into books....... by not allowing us to stack them it slows us, or we would have our geos at full lvl in no time.......
stefanceltare
26.06.13, 05:44
Think logically guys...... In time we may get a building cue, but i think the reason we don't atm is to slow us down, Those who are at higher levels can lvl our buildings up faster therefor make more resources that we can put into books....... by not allowing us to stack them it slows us, or we would have our geos at full lvl in no time.......
in no time = months to a year as it is now...
MizMoneyPenny
26.06.13, 05:59
Granted if we could stack them it will still take us ages, but this way they are trying to stretch us out the only way they can
Looking at the implementation of how books are made, it is extremely obvious that it was intended to not have a queuing system.
It is also obvious from this that the reason to not have a queue system is to introduce a 'lag' between book productions, thus potentially increasing the amount of time needed to build books.
The reason to increase the amount of time to build books is to make having books more precious (another reason why they can not be traded).
Having the books be more precious means that we are encouraged to put more thought into who/what we upgrade.
It can be easily inferred that the upgrading of specliasts via the skill tree is meant to be a slow, gradual thing we do with strategic care.
Those who plan, use strategy in their upgrades will best make use of the precious resource of time.
Those who are even more hardcore and are always around to pop in the next order will benefit even further.
The system looks well balanced, and looks to be working as intended. The only thing we should perhaps curb here is our 'expectation' that we should be able to upgrade 'everything' 'quickly'.
As for me, I've already determined ahead of time that upgrading will be expensive and time consuming, so am saving every book and every point as much as possible to make only critical upgrades.
(Side Note: For new players this is less an issue as they can build the books as they progress. It takes about 1 year for a new player to get to level 50 if they are playing casually, and during that time if they build books they will also have many with which to upgrade their specialists. In a way, level 50 players are '1 year behind' a new player)
Seriously guys, there is no queue intentionally on the Bookbinder. It's akin to asking why we can't stack buffs or queue explorer searches. Not everything in the game is designed to be a set and forget exercise and this is just another example of a time sink of which there are many in the game. Why can we only order 2500 fishfood? Why can't we order more than 25 buffs at a time? Why can't we order more than 25 troops in one instruction? The game rewards you to login and login often, the more you're logged in the more you can catch these non-queue able activities finishing and put the building back to work. BB could design a game that plays itself but the point is, it wants you to be the one doing the work. Simply work out when you want the book to be finished by so that you're online normally at that time.
Seriously guys, there is no queue intentionally on the Bookbinder. It's akin to asking why we can't stack buffs
But when a buff runs out, the building keeps on working. It doesn't just stop.
or queue explorer searches.
Explorer searches are more regular times. eg 1 day. So if you log in about the same time each day, you'll be able to send your explorer off. The bookbinder times are really random.
Why can we only order 2500 fishfood? Why can't we order more than 25 buffs at a time? Why can't we order more than 25 troops in one instruction?
But you CAN queue multiple instances of all these things.
Simply work out when you want the book to be finished by so that you're online normally at that time.
Level 3 bookbinder takes 20 hours for a manuscript. Who logs in regularly every 20 hours? Every 24 hours maybe. Every 12 hours, maybe.
Yes a tome at level 3 takes 24 hours - great! - but at level 4 it takes 18 hours. So if you want to log in when it's ready, you need a a really weird schedule...
This is the main problem: the times have just been plucked out of thin air with no thought given to them whatsoever. If the timings on the bookbinder were more sensible, a queue would be essentially unnecessary.
Explorer searches have many levels only one of which takes 24 hours. If the issue is the timings, how would you make the times more regular when there's three different items and 5 different levels? They can't all be 12 hours/24 hours... The point I was making is that there's many examples of where BB could have made things easier but they haven't and the reason why is that they want you to play the game not just put it on autopilot or that they'll offer a solution for gems. The bookbinder is just another example...
Quite particular to compare queueing the bookbinder to the queueing of explorers.
With explorers you don't know what will be found upfront. Since your next search might be based on what has been found (since there are quests linked to it), I can very well image that no queueing mechanism exists for it.
The bookbinder is a completely different story. You can plan months in advance in what order you want to perform your actions. Pure and simple a waste of all planning you have in mind.
We can discuss long about it, but as long as Science System Part II will not change something explaining this, then there is not a single reason why there should be no queueing system.
Not even in an earlier explanation stating that the difference between low and high level players should not become too large. That difference is becoming larger by the second; the science system is not changing that with even 0.00005%
You guys can quibble over the details all you like but BB have decided intentionally that they want to slow Science progression down, as they intentionally want to slow you down in other ways. Nit picking over small details won't change BB's decision. Why do we have to build X number of fields and wells a day? Why can we only queue things in Prov house/Barracks in small numbers? It all comes back to the same thing... BB wants you to work at the game not just click a few buttons and schedule many months work in one go. Accept that and move on.
I would easily pay gems as well!!!
That's a great idea if you do not want to put it to make the game harder put it in the shop for gems for a WIN-WIN situation!!!
It took 2 weeks to get my geo maxed that was a lot of glue buffs but here's a quick reminder u don't need 5 books at each lvl to progress to the next
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/3094/61bo.png
It is possible to have the bookbinder ,similiar to the barracks/provision house where we can make many books continuous...would be great for everyone
Yes we keep asking for a queue, still don't have one
luigielratto
01.06.14, 10:06
I'll second that. Great idea!
But Don - what about when you use a bookbinder buff, and it ends in the middle of the night as they invariably do (unless you are making 2x manu in succession). A queue would solve this problem and stop half the buff being wasted.
I don't see any advantage to this what so ever, Would be a great suggestion for all those who play say 1 or 2 times a week, not so great for all the daily players.
So i fail to see why a player who logs in every day to make books benefits, I only see this as a benefit to low activity players who can log in once per week and make a weeks worth of book
Maybe a fair compromise would be allowing an addition slot to the book binder if you have premium like with the building Que.
I've logged in everyday for 2 years and just can't be bothered to make the books, why not have a queue? How can you argue we don't need one? Do you really like constantly clicking? Why not remove all queues if that’s your argument? Lets log in 1000x a day just to make 1 troop at a time!
And what difference would it make to you if others want a queue? You can still make one book at a time if you want, I never use glue so none of your arguments make any difference to me, if there's no queue I simply won't make any books, and I bet I'm more active that you as I have an account on all five english speaking servers
I have briefly read these comments, I think the bookbinder queue is still a good idea, I say still because its not a new idea.
I would describe my self as very active (but I do still have a job and go out to socialize, don't neglect my home or anything) It would be very useful to me and from what I've read over the past few months the majority of the Eu forum users agree on this too.
The above poster mentioned about it ending in the middle of the night, I believe he meant the book ending not the buff. At times my books end in the middle of the night, A queue would fix this for me making any glue a lot more efficient.
I think game designers have a responsibility to find a good balance of game time, and offline time, The western world is already facing obesity problems encouraging the player base to be online 18 hours a day for that last deposit or bookbinder etc etc is nothing short of disgraceful. I believe the anno online setup is much superior in comparison with the daily time sink required to tso. The settlers team should be taking note of Anno's dev team and follow the example being set, There are far to many timers ticking here. I believe it is in their interest to try and cap the hourly sink needed, A healthy player base is a happy player base. If we are being totally honest here, I personally think geos/deposits need changing drastically they don't promote a healthy balance.
I do agree that having a queue like the barracks is ridiculous, But having a queue of 1-2 books is perfectly fine. Would allow peeps a little breathing space, between working, sleeping, going out etc.
Lets not forget its probably the people who do have jobs that spend the most money on TSO, not the 15/20 hour a day welfare peeps.
I actually just altered it as I didn't want it to appear I was directing it at you specifically , As that was not my intention. As for how long you personally spend online, I couldn't care a less.
If you don't agree with any suggestion, That is fine, you perfectly with in your rights to have an opinion, Just like others are entitled to theirs. I have posted mine, End of.
Why is it ridiculous having a queue of 25? I just can't see any problem with that, we can make paper and nibs until they're coming out our ears, so why not be able to make 25 books at a time? Like I said if you don't want to make 25 it's your choice, but why should those of us that want a queue be told it's a ridiculous idea just because you don't like it?
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
04.06.14, 03:39
This has been asked since day one and will NEVER happen as it will make producing books a lot easier, and then every level 50 has a ton of resources and buffs and next thing you know TSO goes to pot.
I thought it was common sense why this was the case, and it thought it was common sense, BB responded to this request by releasing RTTBN and ppl had their chance to stock up on this adventure at xmas but many didn't….they went and bought MSE or well nothing , or idk what.
So to conclude for the stability of TSO this will never happen, would be good if there was a 4 book cap limit then at lease 1/4 of my glue wouldn't go to waste but again NEVER gonna happen.
Lets not forget its probably the people who do have jobs that spend the most money on TSO, not the 15/20 hour a day welfare peeps.
Oh and I spend ALOT of time on time, AND I'm not on welfare though AND I invest money into this game, so maybe you should open you mind a tad before sound off like that.
I actually just altered it as I didn't want it to appear I was directing it at you specifically , As that was not my intention. As for how long you personally spend online, I couldn't care a less.
But why do you feel the need to direct it at anyone ?
Funny thing is with options they are generated by life experience, they have not bases for logic and fact. It's the reason criminals are convinced on evidence, not her say.
if you have not experienced circumstance X they you can pass a judgement and say "ahhh well that's my OPIOIN" as almost proving and promoting your own ignorance.
Rather than facing the FACT that it WILL destabilise this games a bit more. The same as a lot of recent introductions have hence the devaluation of coin.
but HEY that's Just my opinion……..or is it ??
Oh and I spend ALOT of time on time, AND I'm not on welfare though AND I invest money into this game, so maybe you should open you mind a tad before sound off like that.
What relevance does that have on working people probably spending more than welfare peeps? Mainly because they have a higher disposable income than the unemployed do, Or they have less time to invest so want the speed up cash brings.
But why do you feel the need to direct it at anyone ?
Who said it was directed at anyone? Its down to common sense, People who work have a higher disposable income than people on welfare, Therefore are able to spend more on life's little luxury's like settlers. Only reason I changed it is because I didn't want Dappadon to take it personal as that was never my intention, But it was not directed at anyone else either.
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
13.06.14, 20:05
Probably because there are more people on those servers, and the ratio of con making lvl 50 players to everyone else is probably smaller. My point is Newfoundland is not the place to introduce lots and lots of books for very player in a very short period of time.
I like the bookbinder idea, but I really hate the implementation. The wasting time already in the production (The cost of books is growing at 10 produced books.) that is good enough. No queue?! I really hate that...
fefekiraly
22.07.14, 07:02
I have 21 explorers. What dou you think dear BB when can I fully skill them? I tell you: about 1 and a half year. And when i cant log in every 12hours when producing manuscripts I just lost a lot of time. When i buff the bookbinder with glue i can only put codex for the night to minimalize the empty run of the bookbinder, but if I can enlist min. 2 books that would help me a lot.
So please think about it!
topgearfan
13.01.15, 12:56
You read it right! A suggestion not to add a queue to Bookbinder building.
(because it will never be added anyway and since this suggestion is the opposite it will surely be added :D )
I dont know about you but I click on bookbinder building to go build a specific book. If I want for example a Codex I want to go and put it to build not build a million of something else first. So if Im missing some prerequisite books for a Codex I should still be able to start building a Codex. The materials and time needed to build the missing prerequisite books would be added to the requirements to build the Codex and the process will start. Possibly add a confirmation describing the additional costs involved.
If prerequisite books are available everything works the same as it does now.
Sharpielein
13.01.15, 18:03
I don't understand?
You want the bookbinder to be idle each and every time your Real Life forces you to not be online between the time the book finishes and you pick it up, then click to build the next?
That's how it is now. So, your suggestion equals "Don't change the Bookbinder"?
I think he is saying,
If he wants to make a codex but he is 3 manuscripts short... He should be able to build the codex for the cost of the codex + the missing manuscripts with a single click.
Sharpielein
13.01.15, 21:12
Ah well, that makes sense.
Actually, I would prefer it if you wouldn't even need to make manuscripts/tomes to produce codices.
Much rather, a codex should simply be 1 object which would require the same resources, so like:
1 Codex = 6k Simple Paper, 5k Nibs, 250 coins, 1k Int Paper, 800 Letters, 500 Advanced Paper and 400 Fittings + production time of like 6 days (at the end, less before).
Since people wouldn't be wasting so much unused bookbinder time with this approach, the amount of paper/nibs/letters consumed would drastically increase, making these items more scarce, which in turn would be good as a global resource sink.
If only the maths was that easy. However there is the problem of what if part way you would have produced enough books so that your next book would be in the next higher expense band.
topgearfan
14.01.15, 11:52
thanks Sharp for describing math behind the idea *wink* in essence this suggestion is a queue without a queue. but please keep that part hush-hush ok? *wink*
Dorotheus, as im pretty sure we cant choose how much a book costs i think its best to leave the adding to the game..
thanks Sharp for describing math behind the idea *wink* in essence this suggestion is a queue without a queue. but please keep that part hush-hush ok? *wink*
Dorotheus, as im pretty sure we cant choose how much a book costs i think its best to leave the adding to the game..
Which will lead to posts in the bugs section due to some players mistakenly believing that they have lost books.
what about the bookbinder.... why can't we order more books at once, we lose time and it takes a lot of it to make a book
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
16.03.15, 22:29
No, this would make the game full of players that have full loaded Geos & Gens, and introduce too much stuff into the market.
It is obvious why BB wanted a cap, 3 book in a chain max, or the game will end up in pieces.....or more pieces than it already is.
stefanceltare
17.03.15, 01:27
No, this would make the game full of players that have full loaded Geos & Gens, and introduce too much stuff into the market.
It is obvious why BB wanted a cap, 3 book in a chain max, or the game will end up in pieces.....or more pieces than it already is.
Yes, way better to have players waste their glue buffs and have idle bookbinders cause oh well, this would make the game full of players with loaded Geos/Gens that used their resources to make said books and so on...
Brilliant reasoning, don't you think?
Edit: I must ask... which gens?
While I would like one, a queue might be difficult given the costs change based on the number of books you have made. Would be difficult to calculate in some ways. I wonder if that's part of the reason there is no queue.
Ozzymandeus
17.03.15, 15:57
While I would like one, a queue might be difficult given the costs change based on the number of books you have made. Would be difficult to calculate in some ways. I wonder if that's part of the reason there is no queue.
Can't remember where I saw it (sorry), but BB devs have gone on the record saying that is one of the two main reasons why developing a bookbinder queue would be a problem... the other being the fact that tomes and codices require other books as part of their 'ingredients' and that those book(s) required might not exist until earlier items in the queue resolve is also problematic for them.
Quite why that stops them from being able to allow us to queue up one of each book type that we have all the 'ingredients' for in advance, I am not sure...
Bluesavanah
17.03.15, 16:36
While I would like one, a queue might be difficult given the costs change based on the number of books you have made. Would be difficult to calculate in some ways. I wonder if that's part of the reason there is no queue.
Since the bookbinder now knows what the next book costs you should at least be able to queue 2 books, this would be handy for those times where people do irritating stuff like working or sleeping.
Since the bookbinder now knows what the next book costs you should at least be able to queue 2 books, this would be handy for those times where people do irritating stuff like working or sleeping.
:)
Can't remember where I saw it (sorry), but BB devs have gone on the record saying that is one of the two main reasons why developing a bookbinder queue would be a problem...
Perhaps.. 20903-Summary-of-GamesCom-Info (http://forum.thesettlersonline.net/threads/20903-Summary-of-GamesCom-Info)
Ozzymandeus
17.03.15, 19:30
Perhaps.. 20903-Summary-of-GamesCom-Info (http://forum.thesettlersonline.net/threads/20903-Summary-of-GamesCom-Info)
That's the fella'.... thanks!
If you go to the original German Article (I ran it through Google translate), they go into their reasons why the Bookbinder queue is problematic.
It's only problematic because they are terrible at their jobs
topgearfan
19.03.15, 12:17
If thats the reason those of us who have maxed the costs should have queues. :D
But soon it wont matter as all my specialists will be maxed and BB seems to have forgotten their promise to make 4 science trees. :(
Ozzymandeus
19.03.15, 14:12
It's only problematic because they are terrible at their jobs
I never said it was a GOOD reason! ;)
Hi,
I believe people are frustrated with a combination of glues lasting to long and the book binder not allowing you to queue books. Well, How about instead of 24-36 hour durations, you standardise on 12 hour on all 3 (Small / Hide & Wilderwood) and you just make them quicker? (20% / 200% & 300%).
This would allow for better management of the buff time available.
CIX
Couldn't agree more - books finished in the middle of the night & the buff wasted until I next log on. I try to time it right but it is not easy.
queen-vicious
02.09.17, 02:47
-1 on reducing buff length
id rather a queue than shorter buffs
No reason they can't make a bookbinder with a short queue even if it's only 4
Queue best - like similar workshops.
TheVictorious
02.09.17, 17:13
queue and only queue, short buff not solve issue
As has been previously posted the devs have ruled out the chances of a queue for the bookbinder.
Queue best - like similar workshops.
Queue is IMPOSSIBLE in bookbinder. They were programmed differently from other workshops and completely redoing them is not going to happen. BB came up with recipes just because queues are impossible in bookbinder. So quit suggesting it.
Better buffs always +1
I don't believe that queue is impossible to bookbinder, just lazy programming. Yes, there are several tiers of prices and ingredients for books, fine. But I don't believe it cannot be implemented once you reached the highest tier for each book ( as in queue for manuscripts once you made 100 of them, queue for tomes once you made 80 of them and queue for codecs once you made 60 of them).
oh, and I will never quit suggesting it or to support this suggestion.
nothing like beating a dead horse....some things you have to take as they are
i agree the buffs and prod time do not relate to each other in any way and 99% of the time buffing my bookbinder is pointless and i dont bother but i really dont see how this idea helps in any way. how about a relatively cheap buff that just speeds up the current item being produced?
how about a relatively cheap buff that just speeds up the current item being produced?
...or a Bookbinder equivalent of Mr. Myers and/or Nash Williams?
Or a queue! And don't say it's been ruled out as other things in the past have been ruled out only to be added
BB says a queue for bookbinder is not possible, but i think they need to look into this again. adding recipes for books in the RPH may of seemed like a good idea, but this then ties up your rph, meaning you cannot make anything else, maybe if a queue for bookbinder is not possible maybe a 3 slot production like woodyards for rph is better, think most people are running rph 24/7 making manuscripts, meaning cant make any of the other stuff in there, and there is soon to be another recipe added for jogging generals, doubt i will get to use that with 24/7 manuscripts going. maybe a send rph :)
PrinceMoon
18.12.17, 07:06
I think book binder is the only building that we dont have a queue facility and we cannot make more than one book binder as well... I hope all the settlers would support me for this request as well and BB would formulate it in a more settlers way....
probably with a deletion up and down facility... and why not with a cancel all as well :) ::A::::A::::A::::A::::A::::A::
It would be more impressive if we can see this feature enabled soon after the next game update ...................
::E::::E::::E::::E::::E::::E::::E::
Happy settling...................
::E::::E::::B::::B::::C::::C::
Won't happen, BB has said several times they want to keep the Bookbinder unique and books hard to get. And the Bookbinder uses a different mechanic form the Barracks & Prov Houses, so a queue is not very easy to implement technically.
They did say in the AMA event they are considering a second Bookbinder, or more/better/different buffs.
Of all production buildings on our islands the bookbinder is the one , which due to it's production limitations, is one in need of improvement.
Many buildings, barracks, provision houses, have the ability to load productions. The bookbinder should have same ability. As it is now, a buff often goes to waste if one is sleeping while the book has ended it's production time.
I would love to have the ability to put into bookbinder cue , 5 manuscripts, 1 tome and toss a buff on it with no need to come back in 6 hours to check status.
Please take this into consideration thank-you for your time.
Mina
Merged
The poor functionality is intended as the developers have specifically refused to add any kind of queue to the bookbinder.
Book Binder and queue, when more production slots?
+0
I think most of us (at least us people that post frequently) have been here before. I appreciate the point that now most buildings have queues. I also appreciate the point that books should perhaps be a little more work and be looked at as more rare.
As it stands now, you could log in on Sunday night and queue large numbers of soldiers and buffs and such. Then during the week log in just enough to get the daily bonus. Then on Friday night have everything you need for some good adventuring. That's fine, that's how the game can work and that's how some people like to play (or that's all they are able to do based on how often then can connect).
If books could be done the same way I think it would make improving specialists too easy. You want top-notch fully skilled generals you're gonna have to either put in some effort or take a lot of time.
And it is also true that the nature of books and their costs changing as they are made makes a queue much more difficult technically.
I've managed to skill up a lot of specialists. Yes, it's taken time and some clock watching when buffs are on but you can get there so I don't think a change has to be made.
You already have a queue for books, in rph. With plenty of good and available buffs to choose from. (2x 3x 4x).
LordDeimos444
15.12.18, 14:34
I think the skill tree refund to player is too heavy burden, if we roughly produce 1 book/codex/manuscript per day ( we busy due to work & family)
Half refund and full refund by 850 Crystal isn't worth it either. Kindly remove this feature, allow us upgrade our generals faster and gaming effectively.
Mannerheim
15.12.18, 18:08
They already addressed this with the RPH book recipes. It has a queue and can do several books a day with buff, eg. 15 manuscripts a day with the best buff combinations.
target rph for manuscripts. Once you get that up and running things change quite quickly.
Wouldn't a bookbinder queue be the best solution for all? Maybe the devs can consider this after they fix all the bugs in the game.
Wouldn't a bookbinder queue be the best solution for all? Maybe the devs can consider this after they fix all the bugs in the game.
No, I very much like the recipe in rph. And there are better buffs for rph than there are for bookbinder
This has been discussed many times already. The recipes were added to the game because there will never be a queue in the bookbinder.
Wouldn't a bookbinder queue be the best solution for all? Maybe the devs can consider this after they fix all the bugs in the game.
They should add a short queue if only to make the buffs worth using, say 2 codex, 4 tome, or as others have mentioned make a buff just long enough for a single book, I gave up trying to get the recipes, I would happily do a hard challenge or pay gems for them, but I'm not doing something 50 times again only to get no recipes
could we please have a que in the bookbinder for making manuscripts, books, for skills, same thing as barracks or snacks. the cost in the RPH to make is not cheaper, and many have not got the upgrades in RPH to make them anyway, many have upgraded their buildings to make paper, fittings etc, and the RPH is usually already busy making other things for quests or buffs,
Good idea would make using buffs on it more cost effective with all the good will in the world we can't be here all the time
It's been asked for so many times I couldn't count them.
Aszbhar_Old
18.12.18, 22:17
I would like to direct those who are not aware of them to answers for Question #61 (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/34774-Ask-Me-Anything-Answers?p=332091&viewfull=1#post332091) and Question #88 (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/34774-Ask-Me-Anything-Answers?p=332734&viewfull=1#post332734) of the Ask Me Anything event, which both touch on the subject of the Bookbinder and the rate of book production.
Powered by vBulletin™ Version 4.0.4 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.