View Full Version : Giving back the improved storehouses
dodos_manus
18.07.14, 15:53
Well
In the spirit of fair play, an error of a software company named "cheat" or "hack". No cheat my friends and no hack happens. Just an error of yours. You didn't try the game in the real world, so you haven't to complain.
Ban is the penalty. Ok. My money back then.
In the spirit of fair play, sent me an email (as I see you know how to do that, and without bugs) with a new paysafe id with all money I give until now, and ban happily my account.
Regards
Filalithis
18.07.14, 15:59
this is not fair.....i allready give some of them as a gift to other players....what u gone do?...bann?....we all have our blogs.....u'll gave us a opportunity for libel.....
UPDATE: If i pay some cash to get gems for 10 storehouses is that disadvantage against other players who have no money?
money ,soldi ,argent ,geld ,dinero ,pecuniam ,pieniądze ,dinheiro ,bani ,деньги ,pengar ,peníze ,nyiaj ,धन ,χρήμα....but nowhere love!
UPDATE2: ladies and Gentlemen ,the point is not for some storehouses ,who cares...but the undisguised hypocrisy by part of the company,
bb has made an error so some players acquired an advantage ,bb asks to those players to return this advantage and then they go to buying so bb earn some money...this is unfair!
Since we want players to demonstrate Fair Play and respect the “Terms Of Use”, we ask all players who redeemed 4 or more Improved Storehouses to put them back into the Star menu. They will be deleted from the Star menu during the next maintenance on the 22nd of July.
Taken from BB_Ravels post as i dont know how to quote i just copy/paste it...
Now for my question... If we have one in out guild who redeemed say 8 imp storehouses he must return 7 of them.. and if another in guild redeemed say 4 he get to keep all 4.. do i read this note right?
Reading your mail about the Improved storage error your programmers made, I see some problems with justice and no admission at all that the mistake came from you, not from the players. A better way to deal with the error, that would acknowledge your responsibility and not discriminate against some players at the expense of others, would be to allow all players who completed the calendar 3 warehouses. At the very minimum, you should also allow players much longer than 4 days to replace the warehouses they sold or gave away in good faith. I have read the TOS but in all that mass of prose it is easy not to be aware that a change to a more generous reward on the part of the game is a "bug" that must not be "exploited." If you really want to be fair to all, you should return any resources players lose because of your rather belated punitive decision.
For instance, many players sold or traded warehouses for other buildings which will now be available, if at all, only at an inflated price. An appropriate means of dealing with this would be to make warehouses available for gold coins at an uninflated price, so that players will not have to leave the game if they do not have the resources to purchase warehouses in T.O. or with gems. Some of us also used resources to upgrade warehouses, but that is a minor burden and I will say no more about it. I may mention that I will not suffer any particular hardships myself because of your demand, but I am concerned about, for instance, high-level players in our guild who gave warehouses to needy lower-level players. They will either have to replace those with their own resources--and not all high-level players are "rich"--or ask the lower level player to return them. I think I speak for many players in feeling that BB's action was neither kind nor "fair to all", and I hope that those with the power to correct the situation will do so. By the way you should certainly allow extra time for players who are not able to be online in the next few days.
Thejollyone
18.07.14, 17:32
there was more than 1 exploit on this event apparently. There was the one that was log off for 15 mins log back in etc which enabled multiple stores (the one BB are on about I'm guessing?)..
And then there was also the one at the start of the event that allowed all players who logged in within the first 15 minutes when the event went live on day 1 which enabled players to open all doors on THAT 1st day. This one happened before the reset, so Im guessing there's an extra store there PLUS the event items...
BB need to clarify which, or indeed both (?) are to be reclaimed?
I fell foul of neither of the above, but Im certain others will also want clarification
'you exploited this bug'
BB YOU created the 'bug' and did not completely test your own product for any errors. When a corporation messes up like that, the corporation pays for its error. BB you are wording your retraction as a PLAYER's infraction. This is not the case. There have been several bugs that you have not fixed and those errors have been to the hardship of the player, throughout your many upgrades, updates, and fixes. Yet the player is the one who pays the cost. This event is just one more 'error' on the part of the corporation. One that your players are going to pay for....
I will tear down any and all improved store houses. Go ahead and scan my island. you will find none left on there. if you deem it necessary to 'ban' me after that... then please be my guest. For YOU, the corporation BB, you will have lost more than just the 'store house' you will have lost a long time player who put money into, and would have continued to fund your corporation.
Enjoy your over banning of accounts, instead of owning up to your own error, your mistake.
greek_dragon
18.07.14, 18:16
They send me a mail. i send them one back
dear support team
first of all pls forgive my English
Today i came back from work and i open to play settlers as i do every day, i have see that you have send me a mail, i open it and i could not believe in my eyes,
you blame me for cheating !!!
ok then lets see what i did, i have take 9 (not 1, not 2, not 3,but 9) improved storehouse,dint you told anyone that he must take only one?
Then you talk about bug? your mistake is not bug is a mistake that i have take in advance, that is cheating? if a football Player do a mistake in a game and lose the ball he ask it back why it whose bug? lern to Live with your mistakes, you are only Human and is natural to do mistake, but dont try to put your mistake to others, and for the fair play part is easy, you give Free improved storehouses to Player that they dint take.
I have play all settlers games and i have love settlers online but i will not give you back the improved storehouses, not because i dont have them, but because i dont think i cheat ( well i have, but not in the game)
so this is goodbye, thanks for the fun i have all this time and i am sorry that i will lose some good friends i make here. And to the people that make that MISTAKE i only say, dont worry be happy and dont feel bad,
thanks for your time
emmanouil kavvousanos
(i always like to say my name and dont hide behind a nicknames wen i say my opinion)
pc. in gategory i put harassment why i think you are harassment all this players by asking back there improved storehouse.
I seem to have missed out on receiving this email...
Given that I got an extra storehouse through no fault of my own, just double clicking on the prize button seemed to do it and I didn't even notice I had two until hours later, and given that I was threatened with a ban from the forums for reporting the bug, I don't feel anyone should be inclined to pay any attention to such emails.
The second you take something from my island is the second i quit the game. Since when do i have to be held responsable for you`re scre.w ups?
Also from the warehouses i got i gave away for free to friends half of them. yer telling me now to ask them back?
Ill wait for maintainance then decide if i play or not. next time maybe cut down the paycheck of the guy that is incapable, not blame the player
Yperellanios
18.07.14, 18:49
Well
In the spirit of fair play, an error of a software company named "cheat" or "hack". No cheat my friends and no hack happens. Just an error of yours. You didn't try the game in the real world, so you haven't to complain.
Ban is the penalty. Ok. My money back then.
In the spirit of fair play, sent me an email (as I see you know how to do that, and without bugs) with a new paysafe id with all money I give until now, and ban happily my account.
Regards
Well said. You want to ban me for your own mistake? That's fine but I want my money back. Deal?
Like any other game, web site, etc. You take advantage of an unexpected software issue that resulted in an unfair advantage, the company has the full right to undo as much of that damage as is reasonable.
And if you got more than 4 warehouses, you were blatantly giggling inanely at yourself that you found a knowing defect that you can take advantage of to get more loot.
BB is being plenty fair with their policy. They'd be in line if they deducted the cost of the warehouse in equivalent gems too.
As for those who want a refund... Get serious... You paid, you used up time playing. Can you return the time you spent playing? Of course not. So don't be going making silly requests.
so your saying that if you got 3 free thats fine but anymore is not
Yperellanios
18.07.14, 19:42
Like any other game, web site, etc. You take advantage of an unexpected software issue that resulted in an unfair advantage, the company has the full right to undo as much of that damage as is reasonable.
And if you got more than 4 warehouses, you were blatantly giggling inanely at yourself that you found a knowing defect that you can take advantage of to get more loot.
BB is being plenty fair with their policy. They'd be in line if they deducted the cost of the warehouse in equivalent gems too.
As for those who want a refund... Get serious... You paid, you used up time playing. Can you return the time you spent playing? Of course not. So don't be going making silly requests.
That "unexpected software issue" should have been tested more like other companies do. It is a mistake at the end of the company not the player. And like you said if they want to undo the damage they should do so themselves not ask the players to do it for them.
Also why are you asking players who want a refund to "get serious"? Isn't BB doing the same thing? I paid for a game working correctly. As long as they make mistakes and the game is not working properly shouldn't I get a refund for what I paid? When the TV you bought doesn't work don't you return it and get a new working one? Please stop [ defending ] BB the only thing you're achieving is receiving more hate from the community.
Hello Yperellanios,
Please don't use profanity on the forums.
Thank you,
Fexno
Atsalakotos
18.07.14, 19:42
Like any other game, web site, etc. You take advantage of an unexpected software issue that resulted in an unfair advantage, the company has the full right to undo as much of that damage as is reasonable.
And if you got more than 4 warehouses, you were blatantly giggling inanely at yourself that you found a knowing defect that you can take advantage of to get more loot.
BB is being plenty fair with their policy. They'd be in line if they deducted the cost of the warehouse in equivalent gems too.
As for those who want a refund... Get serious... You paid, you used up time playing. Can you return the time you spent playing? Of course not. So don't be going making silly requests.
So it's fair for people to have some instead of many. This logic is disapproved. In other games when there are problems that happen from an error of the game itself there is a roll back to a past time to fix things. This is not possible here of course. Let me ask you something else. Lets say, for example, that me myself was one from the people who found this "bug" and said it to plenty others or lets say to everyone i knew and was online at that time and of course it was announced to their friends etc resulting in people saying it in global - is it because i am stupid? is it because i want more people to have also more improved storehouses and not only me? hmm what is it?
What if lets say some of them, because they logged late, and happened to start using this "bug" just a little before BB fix it, got only 3. Of course they would get much much more if BB didn't fix that bug in time. The people that were logged earlier are the bug exploiters but all the rest aren't. Give me a break. Maybe my logic is bad or there is something wrong with me? Probably.
This was just an example after all.
dodos_manus
18.07.14, 20:08
@TotoMok
No my friend, you don't understand the meaning of BB's message.
1. They said that a player "hack" and "cheat". It is a direct blame against any player received that email.
2. They ask for something back, request to buy those items with gems. That means, if you don't have enough gems to do that, you have to buy gems with money. In other words they comes to the level of fraud. Else, I does a mistake and you have to pay for that mistake. (We don't talk about to continue or not to play)
3. I don't understand why a bug that becomes "leak"/"exploit", the players who received that "leak"/"exploit", have to paid for that. If there is a disadvantage against other players then there is another way to make the game "fair". Gift some extra storages to them and set a limit to the others. As I see, they well know how many storages received by any player.
4. Consider that they didn't inform the players about their actions after the event, to prevent them to sell, exchange or gift those resources. It was a "bug" or something else?
I asked my money back, because it is at the same spirit as the BB's message. (In the spirit of fair play).
first of all the mistake is yours and only yours as a company.
We we're not big level and demolish the old store or sell their new stores to get materials for the Quest and you go up level BUY materials for adventures you want us to take it for a YOUR FAULT AND YOUR COMPANY;;;; ; ultimately you're not very reliable company and the wrong yours are paying players .....
I doesnt return a new store if you dont give me all the materials and all of the old coins for my old stores who tear down and all materials that will leave me if Tear down the new, additional and new materials for the staged level. otherwise you will lose another customer.
Would be more right for you to update the first day, your wrong. The mistakes are good to PAY you NOT US.... SO SIMPLE
Consider this:
you go to the bank, and use the ATM machine, put your card in, and before you do anything, the machine spits out some cash. OK, weird, maybe you think, great my money and walk off. OR you stick your card in again and the same happens again, free cash, not from your account. Now, obviously something is wrong, so do you
a) stop, go into the bank and say 'hey, the machine is broken, it's given me this free cash'
b) keep putting your card in and getting all the cash you can (which would be considered theft)
The calendar is supposed to give 1 imp store. Ok, some got more from double clicking, genuine mistake. Some heard of a weird glitch, checked it out and got another. And some purposefully used the glitch to repeatedly get store after store, and no sane person is going to think the calendar is supposed to do that. It is theft, imp stores cost 1995 gems each, and you did not pay for them. Why do you think you are entitled to keep them?
And people are talking of wanting their money back, money back for what, you did not pay for those stores, you have not lost anything you paid for. The people who should be annoyed are the people who spent money on the game to buy gems, to buy imp stores from the merchant, only to have other people exploit a glitch to get theirs for free.
And did I get any extra stores myself? Yes, I got one extra, I heard about the glitch, wanted to see if it was true. I also stopped. If BB asked for my extra store back, yes, I would give it.
Now I have added my opinion, I will be busy polishing my halo over there.
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
18.07.14, 21:35
Kit is right it's the same as taking from an ATM that is kicking out money, which in my country is classed as fraud.
Do i think BB should be asking for gems/payment, as a person who buys gems (or has) not really, they need to let this one go as there is little they can do other than ban players.
ALL My money back.......................NOW
BB policy is that in-game items have no real monetary value. If they did, there are all sorts of trading laws that BB are breaking. The comparison is not only false but dangerous. The only imperative here for anyone to return extra storehouses is a moral one.
This then begs the question: is the typical BB policy to not admit any failure on their part and the apparently (although, I admit I haven't seen the email everyone's talking about to know for sure) agressive manner in which BB are demanding the return of, by definition, valueless items a moral stance?
EDIT: Finally found the message on the forums people are talking about - wasn't showing up on my "new items" list.
Main point to note: nowhere is there an apology for this bug.
Second point to note: BB were given fair warning that the event was bugged and insufficiently tested.
the analogy is false. If someone sends unsolicited goods to me, I have no legal obligation to return them or to pay for them, the burden is on the sender. That is the case here.
However, Gerontius is right, since no monetary value is involved, the whole question is moot.
So in the same interest of fairness, the countless troops & resources poured down the drain doing achievements that failed due to the use of MMA bug. Will BB be refunding me in the same way as expected by us?
In respect of forum policy etc i'm not allowed to show support messages.. However I was told in regards to MMA bug, Unfortunately I was going to have to play the game as unintended. So people who played as unintended on stores are now being penalized & heavily?? BB are seriously playing a silly game here with their players!
I think its pretty generous of BB letting people keep 4 of the storehouses they got for exploiting the bug intentionally, and people really shouldn't be complaining. Those of us that did not exploit the bug got nothing extra from it, so its a pretty unfair advantage.
Filalithis
19.07.14, 00:53
I think its pretty generous of BB letting people keep 4 of the storehouses they got for exploiting the bug intentionally, and people really shouldn't be complaining. Those of us that did not exploit the bug got nothing extra from it, so its a pretty unfair advantage.
while if I would buy them with gems would not be unfair.....right?
while if I would buy them with gems would not be unfair.....right?
If you're forced to buy the extras with gems when you wouldn't have otherwise done that, it would be unfair as well. I guess you can save that possibility by returning them, and that seems to be exactly what BB are letting you do.
they want to give them back the extra storehouses ok i do .but i have a question why it is fair for some ppl to keep 4 storehouses and myself keep only 1?
this is not fair.....i allready give some of them as a gift to other players....what u gone do?...bann?....we all have our blogs.....u'll gave us a opportunity for libel.....
UPDATE: If i pay some cash to get gems for 10 storehouses is that disadvantage against other players who have no money?
money ,soldi ,argent ,geld ,dinero ,pecuniam ,pieniądze ,dinheiro ,bani ,деньги ,pengar ,peníze ,nyiaj ,धन ,χρήμα....but nowhere love!
where did ya get this čirilica letters and hidu keyboard???..you forget DENAR
YES precious....exploits are made to be exploited..THE EXPLOITED the best PUNK band in the land...long live rock n roll:=)))
DrinkMoreMilk
19.07.14, 06:20
Aren't adventure blocks an exploit? Interesting consequences if so...
well what if you are a Paladin..and Paladins pwns warriors,becouse they are the harbingers of light..so integrated light is better then artificial one...(Joe Karambas-Karamazof)
Karamazof agrees with you..Alexander the great challenged the world in a short term,died young ..he was the best headroller in history and all knows his name..Greece is Bella pais..long live Gyros and tsasiki....i bet he didnt know english as well as we do..
Consider this:
you go to the bank, and use the ATM machine, put your card in, and before you do anything, the machine spits out some cash. OK, weird, maybe you think, great my money and walk off. OR you stick your card in again and the same happens again, free cash, not from your account. Now, obviously something is wrong, so do you
a) stop, go into the bank and say 'hey, the machine is broken, it's given me this free cash'
b) keep putting your card in and getting all the cash you can (which would be considered theft)
The calendar is supposed to give 1 imp store. Ok, some got more from double clicking, genuine mistake. Some heard of a weird glitch, checked it out and got another. And some purposefully used the glitch to repeatedly get store after store, and no sane person is going to think the calendar is supposed to do that. It is theft, imp stores cost 1995 gems each, and you did not pay for them. Why do you think you are entitled to keep them?
And people are talking of wanting their money back, money back for what, you did not pay for those stores, you have not lost anything you paid for. The people who should be annoyed are the people who spent money on the game to buy gems, to buy imp stores from the merchant, only to have other people exploit a glitch to get theirs for free.
And did I get any extra stores myself? Yes, I got one extra, I heard about the glitch, wanted to see if it was true. I also stopped. If BB asked for my extra store back, yes, I would give it.
Now I have added my opinion, I will be busy polishing my halo over there.
i would ofc take money..not giefing it back..newah..the machine is broken..ok..machine has problems not old Kara..banks are Iluuminatti..banks made us all poor by the day we giveourselfs a birth^^ so why would precious gief money back if they stole it from US from day 1...machines problems..not mine...only stupid would goto bank and gief money back..95 % of planet peoples wouldnt goto band and talk:::please this money machines spitted ..pls take it back..people are hungry they use the money to buy Gyros and tsasiki instead..Long live R n R..
loving all the cry babys here you seen a glitch you took adantage now you been caught give the stuff back because if they sent you a mail they know you took advantage ...you have two options give the items back and all is well or climb on your soup box and proclaim you keeping the stuff if you take the latter dont come crying when they ban your ass when they gave you the chance to fix what you did wrong...unless your really really stupid you knew getting multiples was a mistake
loving all the cry babys here you seen a glitch you took adantage now you been caught give the stuff back because if they sent you a mail they know you took advantage ...you have two options give the items back and all is well or climb on your soup box and proclaim you keeping the stuff if you take the latter dont come crying when they ban your ass when they gave you the chance to fix what you did wrong...unless your really really stupid you knew getting multiples was a mistake
Me NO HABLA ENGLEZZZZ
Sorry but it's your own fault. As soon as you noticed you could get more then one you should have stopped and reported it immediately. It's called being responsible. The fact so many of you just kept clicking and didn't do a thing .. yep that is cheating. See if you had all stopped at the 2nd click and reported it then the damage would have been small and they might even have allowed you to keep it. Yet you willfully kept clicking, selling them for a lot if things you otherwise would not have been able to get (so yep again cheating). The fact you didn't feel any responsibility to not abuse a glitch says more about you then them. I knew about the glitch and I didn't use it at all. Some may consider this stupid, I consider it playing honest and fair. So yeah your own fault for abusing a glitch you knew would have consequenses.
Now crying that they are at fault for you abusing the glitch is ridiculous. Are they to blame for the glitch itself? yes. Are they to blame for you abusing it? No. That is completely your own action and responsibility.
They send me a mail. i send them one back
dear support team
first of all pls forgive my English
Today i came back from work and i open to play settlers as i do every day, i have see that you have send me a mail, i open it and i could not believe in my eyes,
you blame me for cheating !!!
ok then lets see what i did, i have take 9 (not 1, not 2, not 3,but 9) improved storehouse,dint you told anyone that he must take only one?
Then you talk about bug? your mistake is not bug is a mistake that i have take in advance, that is cheating? if a football Player do a mistake in a game and lose the ball he ask it back why it whose bug? lern to Live with your mistakes, you are only Human and is natural to do mistake, but dont try to put your mistake to others, and for the fair play part is easy, you give Free improved storehouses to Player that they dint take.
I have play all settlers games and i have love settlers online but i will not give you back the improved storehouses, not because i dont have them, but because i dont think i cheat ( well i have, but not in the game)
so this is goodbye, thanks for the fun i have all this time and i am sorry that i will lose some good friends i make here. And to the people that make that MISTAKE i only say, dont worry be happy and dont feel bad,
thanks for your time
emmanouil kavvousanos
(i always like to say my name and dont hide behind a nicknames wen i say my opinion)
pc. in gategory i put harassment why i think you are harassment all this players by asking back there improved storehouse.
this is ma man,,i would need you in our guild if we were played on the same server..me no take no warehouses..me no cheat in game..( i cheat elsewhere also),,..like your logics explainations..,BB stupid to ask somethin back that they gief freely to peoples to have ,becouse they didnt check the game events before they put in the game..BB s own fault..
dodos_manus
19.07.14, 09:12
@Rhylian
You didn't understand what I'm saying.
Lets say, I made a mistake and I played this game. With the BB's logic, BB has to return back all the money I paid for the game, if I claim any potential reason.
With the same logic, they rober me, because with real money I bought their virtual products. Those products I can't claim them back without any known way when they will ban me, except the way I bought them, means real money.
Regarding the game, of course I have enough impr storages and gems to return back the 4+1 I had gotten. No big deal. Think that I gifted impr storages and any kind of buildings to friends before last event.
My point. I can't accept all those threats (ban) and blames (hacker or cheater) against me or any other player as it is just a game. Blames and threats belongs to the real world, if you understand the basics of legal principles.
Well then don't cheat. If you cheat they have the right to ban you, no matter how much money you have spent. And no they don't have to pay you that back if you cheated. Again it's called being responsible for your own actions. Which you all seem to have hard time with.
Mortallicus
19.07.14, 10:09
Whatever the rights or wrongs of what some players may or may not have done. BB made a mistake. IMO they are now being too heavy handed. Undoubtedly someone will go into a flat spin that only got 1 extra and buy with gems another to replace or worse buy from TO at 23K gc plus from someone selling their ill gotten gains. Its also pegi 7, what child is not going to just click and click away. I find the whole thing depressing from all perspectives and because of the way this is being handled. Why not before each event give a warning that if what is obviously a bug or mistake is exploited this could result in a ban.Then do it. Learn from this mistake.
Anyone who took advantage of this is not going to change they may even swiftly sell them off faster in TO at highest price possible exploiting others trying to get 1 back in their star. BB say trade to get them back!!!
Except that it is in the ToS already ... so no need for them to give a warning every event over and over. Just because people do not read it, is their own problem. As they DID agree to the ToS when they made an account. Again it's called responsibility. Any piece of software that has coding can have on occasion glitches. Even if tested. Fixing it is BB's responsibility, but not taking advantage of it is ours
Mortallicus
19.07.14, 10:43
I know its in the rules already but there are not many events basically there are i think 3 main events a year and a warning beforehand is no biggie.
There are other factors to reading and understanding e.g. Age and Language. All im saying is its going to upset the wrong people and gives yet another way for the unscrupulous to make more gc in TO.
Filalithis
19.07.14, 10:44
Except that it is in the ToS already ... so no need for them to give a warning every event over and over. Just because people do not read it, is their own problem. As they DID agree to the ToS when they made an account. Again it's called responsibility. Any piece of software that has coding can have on occasion glitches. Even if tested. Fixing it is BB's responsibility, but not taking advantage of it is ours
i allready sent some cash to bb for the storehaouses ,so no need to feel aggrieved......
ATHTHEMANIAC
19.07.14, 11:57
at the end of the day people have cheated by taking much more then they are entitled to,it is obvious to all that 1 store house was the prize for opening all the doors.,but when certain players found an error in the programme they took advantage and now have been caught.i dont think any player who got more then 1 store house should keep them bb have the info on who got what and even if people have traded them they know that too....so bb just make a script and remove all the stolen store houses if some one took extra and has upgraded them tough they knew they did wrong so now suffer the penalty through lost materials and if they removed old store house to replace with a stolen one the the penalty for theft is just greater more fool them..if players who have stolen the store house wanna leave because they got caught cheating then let them leave :).as for people who bought stolen store houses just refund what the traded good.
it is definately not fair to let some people keep stolen stores this would mean bb condone the theft surely ?
The problem is also there is never mentioned there is 1 storehouse at the end. Read the Dev Diary and nothing is mentioned for the end award. Only mentioned, you can get buildings from the calendar; last 1 just happened, more buildings were coming.
Treat everyone the same. If you got more than 1 Improved Storehouse EVERYONE should pay them back. Those that got 2 goes at the event calendar and got everything twice should also pay everything back. That is fair, it is not fair to make a judgement of how many extra people got and let those who got 3 keep them and those who got 4 have to return 3. That is not fair.
2 of my family, in error registered on a different realm to mine and other friends. They asked to transfer, but were told it was not possible so they spent a lot of time, money, and gems to get to level 46 and higher. When you introduced co-operative adventure they then spent similar amounts of time, money and gems to get back to the same levels on a different zone. TSO were asked to transfer a small amount of the resources to the new zone so we could delete the redundant accounts, but were refused. TSO have different rules for themselves and for their customers. That is not fair either. Until recently it was clear that the original players in Germany were getting preferential treatment in competitions, purchase of gems etc. It is time TSO got their act together and made TSO the pleasure and fair to everyone equally.
Except that it is in the ToS already ... so no need for them to give a warning every event over and over. Just because people do not read it, is their own problem.
Where in the ToS exactly?
think i shouId get 2 more storehouses feeI Ieft out i missed the bug IoI
BB onIy care cos they missing out on gems IoI funny how they dont give refunds on mis advertising imp siIos tho ;)
funkybean2013
19.07.14, 17:09
BB should just take the hit on the chin and man up, it was their fault and a few players took advantage of an opportunity is all. BB is at fault and no one else.
It was a bug and people knew it was a bug.
In many games, the support staff would just ban you for exploiting a bug. At least BB are giving you the chance to return the exploited items without any further action.
Sounds fair to me.
It was a bug and people knew it was a bug.
In many games, the support staff would just ban you for exploiting a bug. At least BB are giving you the chance to return the exploited items without any further action.
Sounds fair to me.
It would be fair if everyone had to give the extra stores back the ones from the beginning of the event and at the end. BB are saying it is ok to keep 4 so thats what I will do I will return 1.
ATHTHEMANIAC
19.07.14, 17:49
its funny to hear people say its BB fault and they should just live with it....to them people i say this.
if you forgot to lock your window (bug) and a thief opened it (exploited it) stole all your stuff would you just say ah its my fault i dont want my stuff back when the police catch them....i think not.
also would the thief argue that its not my fault they did'nt lock the window so i should be able to keep all the items i stole ?.......
as for BB the police once catching the thief would not allow them to keep some of the stuff either....
its funny to hear people say its BB fault and they should just live with it....to them people i say this.
if you forgot to lock your window (bug) and a thief opened it (exploited it) stole all your stuff would you just say ah its my fault i dont want my stuff back when the police catch them....i think not.
also would the thief argue that its not my fault they did'nt lock the window so i should be able to keep all the items i stole ?.......
as for BB the police once catching the thief would not allow them to keep some of the stuff either....
if i was throwing stuff out the windows would an innocent passer by be a thief if he kept the items thrown out on the pavement?
these storehouses were thrown on the pavement, i got an extra one from the 15 min test session on the 1st day, leveled it up asap, very happy, thanks BB :)
nearly, but not quite makes up for the 2400 useless footballs i have in storage, stupid me thought the shop was open for another few days after teh event closed like every other event, backed up by me thinking the 12 days allowed to complete the final would actually be 12 days not 5, thanks BB :( , yes, i should have read the announcements a lil more carefully but i tend to leave my settlers window open 24/7 & dont read them everyday :(
Bug?
or how about we creat a bug and then force people, by threatening bans, to spend more money on the game creating more revenue for the company.
Fantastic idea with a great cover up, you deserve a promotion !!!!
This is a complete load of censored !!!!
Please do not use profanity
I didn't use the exploit and really don't care about that some did, as that do not negatively affect my playtime experience.
Thou ATM, on testserver, BB seems to go for an Imp Storehouse entrance change (http://forum.tsotesting.com/threads/20434-improved-storehouse-entrance-relocated). THAT's something I care about.
If BB think it's a great idea to move the entrance, then they could have handled this a lot better.. How about letting everyone keep 4 imp storehouse and give some extra to those not using the exploit...and also announce about the entrance change?!?
Iike they ever teII us anything worth knowing :/
?? i dont have 4 imp houses ?? will i be ban then if i dont return one to star ?
I am loving this thread.
Some people may have got one or two extra 'by mistake' or through ignorance. Well done BB for ignoring this group as not attempting to create an unfair advantage.
Some people will have got loads through deliberately exploiting a flaw in what is to start with buggy code. I have heard of people getting over 10 this way and many that went on to sell them for top prices making maybe 1/4 million coins. Well done BB for targeting the group that deliberately exploited the bug and created a significant advantage.
And for all the righteous people saying I got loads and gave them away for free, well done to you but its not difficult to ask for them back. After all the cynic in me says many will have offered to loan them out for a few weeks whilst waiting to see if BB try to get them back.....
PS - Heres hoping that BB end up maybe banning hundreds of accounts. Especially those multi accounters that will have really abused this flaw. Will be one way to reduce tonights lag with a single script.
Yperellanios
19.07.14, 19:18
So the points to be made here as long as I'm concerned are as follows:
1.BB and the "righteous" people supporting BB's claim over the extra storehouses (=the ones that didn't manage to get enough of them using the bug for whatever reason) keep talking about the ToS stating that this is not allowed but I have yet to see someone link the actual point in the ToS that supports this.
2.BB decides that if you have up to 3 storehouses you're cool but those getting 4 are marked as "cheaters" and "hackers". I really don't appreciate this kind of namecalling especially if BB's own mistake made this possible to happen. There is a guy (or more) responsible to test this thing and if he's not doing his job right you should consider placing the blame on him and not annoy the players who found out about this and then shared this knowledge with their friends (like I and I hope most others did).
3.Also if you want the players to return the storehouses back you should at least credit back the resources wasted in the upgrade of the said storehouses and also the ones used in the upgrade of the storehouses that were used in the place of those new ones.
4.Many people said that they want their money back if BB bans their accounts. We all know that something like this is never going to happen as we also know that BB is NEVER going to ban players that spend their money on the game over a couple of lame buildings. I don't think they will ban people who pay them just because a bug/glitch gave them some extra "unfair" resources.
With these thoughts in mind I have decided to NOT return everything to star menu and advice my guildmates to do the same. If the BB decides to ban us it's their loss more than ours. THEY are going to lose the money that we would have spent in the game in the future. Other similar games would welcome this cash I'm sure.
P.S.:Hey BB! When is PvP coming? I guess you were too busy "testing" the proper release of the football event, right? :P
Somebody wrote here that it was a bug and people knew it was a bug.
I did not know it was a bug. I noticed i had one extra and i wondered how come there's (in star menu) another one after i just built one in my island.
after that i read from the chat that it was a bug.
I didn't exploit it, i did not try to sell it or get some more, but i did build it to my island since there was no information from the BB about the extra storehouse here in this forum. So i did take a conscious risk and built also the extra one in my island.
But now it is demolished again and in my star menu, although i did belong to that group, that had permission to keep the extra one. It is not that big of a loss for me, if BB take it away. I get the upgrading resources back quite easily. For some other player issue could be worse.
I do wish, that BB would have made information here on this forum about the situation right away so that people would not have gone and build their extra storehouses in the heat of the moment.
Just read the ToS -_- Can't be that hard. And you should have when you started this game. And how is BB responsible for you abusing a glitch? Did they put a gun to your head and told you to keep clicking? Seriously have some responsibility for your own actions and stupidity will you? All games can contain glitches. All game company ask that you report them and not abuse them. This is called COMMON SENSE, which a lot of people seem to lack -_-. I mean how old are you? It's simple, they had a glitch, which is their fault but it can happen with any piece of coding. But you clicking multiple times on it ON PURPOSE is quite simply your own responsibility. You could have known action would be taken. The fact you make it sound like you have no restraint at all and that if you find a glitch you are somehow compelled to abuse it because you cannot stop yourself ... well get therapy for that -_-. You knew you were abusing a glitch and instead of reporting and getting them to fix it a.s.a.p. you tried to keep it quiet. So you are the ones to blame for the glitch abuse, not them. And if you lose your account because of that? Well read the ToS ... they have the right to do so, without warning or explanation.
i onIy got 1 SH and i gave it away to someone in my guiId as i have no need for it doesnt bother me how many ppI got end of the day if paypaI made a mistake and gave BB doubIe £'s for transactions bet they wouId fight to keep em?? and the way they go about cIaiming thier {property} which in fact does not cost them a penny is stupid very stupid because your threatening paying customers reaIIy! u need to work on your customer service
no communication....
oh hoId on u got extra due to a fauIt of their own...
now get communication...
oh its to get a few extra £'s/$'s....
RhyIian its not Iike they are using a hack tooI or muItiaccounting their was not a counter saying just 1 storehouse in the caIender, 4 posts and u say a hundred pIayers have no common sense ur braver then me :P
Yperellanios
19.07.14, 20:05
you tried to keep it quiet
I'm gonna ignore everything else that is just an insult to everyone's intelligence and focus on this quoted sentence.
I just said I told it to everyone I know and everyone I know did the same. I don't think this is a good way to "keep it quiet". People were even talking about this in global and none in BB said anything about it until now. I'm sorry but I think I waited an appropriate amount of time before placing down these storehouses and starting to upgrade them. For me it's not a matter of being cheap I could have bought 10 times the 4 storehouses I got anytime of the day. It's a matter of integrity from BB. They released an event without having tested it properly. Admit your mistake and move on. Like I said stop bothering people with it, be a man and learn from this mistake to avoid situations like this in the future.
Also you keep saying read the ToS but you're still not quoting. Having trouble finding something that can help your case?
dodos_manus
19.07.14, 20:14
@Rhylian
Lets make an hypothesis.
Lets say that you're a spiun of BB, because as I seen you only replied to this thread your 4 first times, saying the same and the same, without really understand what I'm saying, or maybe you understand, but you does the duck, as we say in Greece.
From now and ever, everyone who reads the above, he will think that Rhylian is MAYBE a spiun or a REALLY spiun of BB. That makes you directly unreliable person, because I told an idiot argument about you.
This is absolutely the same as the BB's message. A cheater remains a cheater, a hacker remains a hacker, a scammer remains a scammer. And all of that related to their mistake. They had to ask back the resources with a better way. Has nothing to do with all you wrote above.
Wow you do know that I meant keep it quiet from BB. Not from others so they could abuse it as well? :P And yes if you actually had read the ToS you wouldn't ask me to quote because you would know. So I have no trouble finding it, I am just not going to look it up for you. You should have read it when you agreed to it when you signed on :P As for admitting their mistake lol then why aren't you admitting your mistake? "yeah I knew it was a glitch but I just couldn't stop myself from clicking and clicking" :P Nooooo it is BB's mistake!! They made you click all those times!! Even though you knew it would have consequences, you just could not stop yourself!! In fact if it was a shop and you went there to pick up a free bicycle and you noticed a gate was open which would allow you to take even more bikes before they would find out then you totally would have done that too!! And it would be the store's fault for you stealing those bikes and not walking inside to tell them they left their gate open right? Because hey you have no reason or desire to be responsible for your own actions amiright? :P
Rhylian - Have you tried imodium?
Either way, I hope you get better soon :)
Lol I am fine ... I am perfectly capable of being responsible for my own actions like a normal adult ... unlike many people here -_- So maybe something for you that Imodium?
Yperellanios
19.07.14, 20:32
@Rhylian
I love your examples they are so realistic hahaha :)
I also love how you keep talking about the ToS when you have clearly not read a word it says as it is obvious from your inability to quote it when asked.
Also I'm wondering why are you so worked up about this bug if you don't have a horse in this race? I suppose you're one of the "good guys" that blames all us "hackers" for taking the extra storehouses. You clearly knew about the bug from the beginning and immediately reported it to BB, right? Now get on your "bicycle" and go to BB to collect your allowance for siding with them against the rest of the community :)
Dry your eyes, if you exploited a bug just be thankful it isn't a straight ban.
Good guy? No. Mature and responsible for my own actions? Yes. Capable of predicting the consequenses of my own actions? yes. And how can you claim that I have not read anything when you are quite obviously too lazy to look it up yourself? Another part of your own responsibility. Or did you miss the "I have read the terms of service and I agree with all in it" you were required to accept when creating an account? And yes I blame you for taking those storehouses. Who else? Did anyone else make you take them? Did someone put a gun to your head to keep clicking? Are you unable to not abuse a glitch? And sorry to burst your bubble, I am not getting an "allowance". I just have a brain and I use it :P And the rest of the community? hmmm I can assure you most of the community will not be affected by BB taking actions. Because you know ... they can be responsible for their own actions :P Which appearantly you cannot?
Just to stop some of the bickering, its Section 16 in the ToS that gives them the right to ban accounts pretty much for any reason at any time. The In Game Rules and Code of conduct (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/21679-In-game-Rules-Code-of-conduct-%28chat-and-forum%29) deals with more specifics of hacking and cheating, but this issue seems to fall into a grey area outside of that since there was no change to the game functions on the players' part and (as it was available to all players without use of any forbidden actions) it did not give a distinct advantage to one player over another.
I will admit to being one of the exploiters. I used 2 on my island, sold two and the rest were for charity, good will and player retention. I'm happy to return the ones I still have, but I flatly refuse to ask for the return of those which have been given as gifts to newer players. If they choose to ban me for it, so be it. I think its shady that they found and fixed the error on the 12th, but waited until the 18th to say anything about it, which only compounded the problem for the players, but I'm a big girl. I knew what I was doing. And these are the risks.
So I will await my response from Support about the fate of my account, and am eager to learn when they will be recalling the account enriching goods from other exploits in the calendar and in the game.
Yperellanios
19.07.14, 21:17
@foofygirl
You pretty much covered it all. The same goes for me. I'm not giving back anything if they want to ban me, be my guest. It's their loss I'll be happy to spend my money in another game.
... This is called COMMON SENSE, which a lot of people seem to lack -_-. I mean how old are you?...
Well since this is a PEGI-7 game 7+ I guess. If you think a 7 year old can read and understand the terms and conditions, or be necessarily aware of the fact that this was an 'exploit': how much common sense do you have?!
______
BB great job of coming across as threatening whilst trying to cover up your latest blundering error, whilst further alienating players to the detriment of the whole player community once again. (I accept the sentiment of expecting fair play and the fact that your terms and conditions are tighter than a gnat's backside; but to come out guns blazing mentioning bans and referring to T&Cs after your track record of lackadaisical support/development/communication is beyond brazen even for you.)
So the latest strategy is try and get enough people to quit playing the game to shut the servers down and cut your losses?! Fair play... it's worked with me since I've only been coming back to keep island active etc. in the naive hope you actually want people to keep playing; and that you'd fix some bugs and bring in some decent new stuff one day...
Bah
You knew it was a bug, a pretty serious one. How could you not think BB would find out about it? Honestly, do you really think you are entitled to keep the items?
It reminds me of something that happened a few years ago. A couple had 10 million dollars mistakenly put in their bank account. They knew it was an error, but they immediately transferred the money to offshore accounts and fled the country. Why did they run? Because they knew it was theft. I am not sure what happened in the end, but i know that the bank was able to recover some of the money (as they should), and I think one of them was jailed.
This issue is remarkably similar, and I think its very generous of BB for letting you return the items you acquired through abusing the game, letting you choose to do the right thing, and not straight up banning you. It doesn't matter if you gave the items for free to lower level guildies, as any advantage to them would be an advantage to you in the long run, and you can't argue that fact.
... oh yeah, and all of you comparing pixels with real money... try going outside more please for your own sake!
@toastkid ... yes and all those who exploited were kids right? Not to mention that an adult has to be responsible for a minors actions as agreed to in the ToS ... So yeah I think my common sense is still fine ... yours I am questioning -_-. Because just letting a minor go unsupervised online ... meaning you don't check what he signs up to, you don't check what he does online ... you don't check if maybe he buys stuff ... yeah bad parenting 101. First thing a responsible adult would do is check what his kid does don't you think? Not necessarily check everything, but at least find out what he agreed to when singing up to something .... might be a novel concept to you I guess ...
Seriously this is why so many 13 year olds are playing 18+ games like GTAV or CoD ... the adults that should be there to provide guidance and watch over them, just don't bother at all anymore and just buy what the kid asks for and are then surprised at the end results -_-
Well since this is a PEGI-7 game 7+ I guess. If you think a 7 year old can read and understand the terms and conditions, or be necessarily aware of the fact that this was an 'exploit': how much common sense do you have?!
Actually, I have kids myself, one has just turned 9, and he knows the difference between playing a game as it is intended, and cheating via game exploits. He doesn't know what the word "exploit" means, but he understands the concept, and I see it all the time when I play with him. I am not sure how old you are, or whether you remember what you understood at age ~7, but i don't think you have a clue as to what kids these days actually know. My point is, stop using PEGI-7 as an excuse to try to get away with it. Get real.
... oh yeah, and all of you comparing pixels with real money... try going outside more please for your own sake!
Lol. I go outside all the time! Don't worry, your personal attacks won't work on me.
.... just some pixels ... TV = just some pixels too, you pay for that? Or do you steal that too? Or how about music? You steal that too? I mean why should the artist ask money for that right? It's just sound! Or Data when you download it! Seriously go ahead and tell them to go outside more too ...
You two should meet up in a cybercafe (paying for the virtual coffee of course). If you sit facing each other you'll have a 360 degree view against personal attacks ;)
Anyway, thanks for giving me a bigger laugh than I've had in game for months though, and have fun counting your pixels :D
Anyway, thanks for giving me a bigger laugh than I've had in game for months though, and have fun counting your pixels :D
Glad you had a laugh, I did too (at the excuses). :)
Yes I am sure being a responsible adult understanding that you can't just do what you want is something to laugh about!! And I am laughing very very hard ... at all these people that can't even be responsible for their own actions and can only come up with ridiculous excuses as to why it is ok for them to steal (yep someone coded that and that means he had to be paid for it so you are essentially stealing from his paycheck ;)) and not be responsible adults rofl
Filalithis
19.07.14, 23:45
@foofygirl
You pretty much covered it all. The same goes for me. I'm not giving back anything if they want to ban me, be my guest. It's their loss I'll be happy to spend my money in another game.
thumbs up! man...
ATHTHEMANIAC
20.07.14, 00:11
herbal-T "if i was throwing stuff out the windows would an innocent passer by be a thief if he kept the items thrown out on the pavement?" answer no because you intentionally made a decision to throw the stuff out...where as BB unintentionally left a bug in the programming two totally different things, if you dont understand that then i feel sorry for you as you lack any logic.
cant BB just run a scipt to remove the stolen store house's ?....they have all the info on where they are surely,i am not a programer so am unsure if this is possible as asking a thief to return something is not goner happen like all the thiefs have stated in this thread they are happy to keep the stolen goods whatever happens,using the " i would be spending money if they dont ban me for cheating" is pathetic way of tying to get away with it imo.
If you take out 10 imp storehouses and dont get its a bug/exploit you are so stupid you should get banned just for that :confused:
Dont do the crime if you cant do the time, ever heard that saying? BB ban the crap out of em :mad:
And the BB isn't responsible for their actions? Isn't BB responsible to test the event before to give it to the users without bugs?
And the inability of the BB to patch the bug must be ban people who accidentally make use of the bug.
Very ironic logic.
... all these people that can't even be responsible for their own actions and can only come up with ridiculous excuses as to why it is ok for them to steal (yep someone coded that and that means he had to be paid for it so you are essentially stealing from his paycheck...
errmm, sorry, I didn't realise they had to code each one from scratch... they must get through loads of keyboards :(
And the BB isn't responsible for their actions? Isn't BB responsible to test the event before to give it to the users without bugs?
And the inability of the BB to patch the bug must be ban people who accidentally make use of the bug.
Very ironic logic.
Lol yeah they accidentally logged in and out more then 4 times (I have heard some even got themselves 10 or more) and accidentally told other people to do the same? Yeah you kinda do not get the concept of accidentally. Do you know what is accidentally? Clicking once or twice. Oh and guess what? Those people do not get banned and BB acknowledged that and those people will actually get to keep those Imp store houses ... It's very ironic you didn't bother to read their post at all and then made this statement of yours ...
@Toastkid Oh wow what a comeback!! Is that all you can come up with for an excuse? No idea how businesses work?
Like: servers that have to paid, programmers that have to be paid, building that has to be paid, marketing that has to be paid etc etc.
How is this done? By revenue generated from various sources such as? yes also from the stuff coded in the Merchant.
And while they only have to code it once, the amount of time it took to code it has costs associated with them. And any profit generated from it is put towards things that do not generate profit (such as building costs). So that is one heck of a lame comeback man. How old are you?
@Toastkid... ...How old are you?
Why, are you trying to groom me? :(
Just trying to figure out if you are naturally daft or just not old enough to know better -_-
errmm, sorry, I didn't realise they had to code each one from scratch... they must get through loads of keyboards :(
In a thread full of children fighting a fight that isn't their fight, This actually made me smile :)
Everyone is accountable for their own actions but this is down to BB to sort out, not me.
Lots of lol :)
1. BB should realize there are lots of kids playing, which is why we cant talk about half of the world in the main-chat. You cant say *you should have read the TOS and you're responsible for your own actions* to an 8 year old.
2. it's not Always clear if something is a mistake, a bug, or random bad programming from BB. Blocking camps is *not intended and therefore not supported by BB*, or somewhere along that line. Does not intended (like more then 1 storehouse) mean we should not use it? Or the little trick to let your geo's find surplus ore, that's more or less a bug as well and I'm sure lots of people are using it. BB must know as well, but they somehow tolerate that exploit. "It's in the TOS" isn't a great argument if the TOS isn't held up in other situations.
And last but not least: Can the developers please stop introducing new bugs and stack the items in my star menu first? It's getting a bit crowed there. (not counting warehouses, I just took 1)
AndreKellner
20.07.14, 09:02
I received an e-mail too. I'm not going to give them back. Not because I don't have them or because I don't want to demolish them. I'm not giving them back because I didn't cheat. I just took the opportunity of the bug that was pointed out to me by my dear guildies. This option was open to anyone... how is this cheating? It's not like we compete against eachother through storage space. It may have been to some advantage if BB would finally implement the PVP they've been promising us for decades. And how fair is it when it comes to buying stuff with gems. If someone pays for advantages over other players, then it's suddenly fine. It's only fine because it pays your paychecks. This does not have anything to do with fair-play. This was a mistake, someone may have had to answer for it and now under the false flag of fair-play and honesty try to undo the "damage".
Most of my guildies that have taken advantage of this opportunity have either sold or given away the storages to lower level players. We use these items for in-guild events and contests. I'm guild leader of one of NFL's biggest guilds and we have a lot of active, loyal and honest members that actually spent a lot of money and time on this game. Most of us are playing for long and supported BB throughout the beta stage of this game. We had to endure many bugs and lags and the inconveniences they caused but we stayed because we're loyal and like the game. Some bugs were to our advantage but most were not and yes we complained but hardly received compensations worth mentioning. I know many players that lost gems and resources over bugs. Many players have had issues logging on for periods of time without proper compensation.
What about the end of the world and the 20th aniversarry events, that wasn't fair and despite many complains nothing was done about it.
I will stand for my guildies and do whatever is possible to speak up for them (not that they need it) and fight for their rights. This is your bug, your fault, your problem BB! Hands of from our islands!!!
topgearfan
20.07.14, 09:14
it appears i was really tired or smth a few days ago and wrote myself a really wierd/threathening letter about exploits or whatever and did it impersonating "The Settlers Online" team(isnt it bannable to do that?).
of course i did not write it and thus i have a question: is it allowed to send messages from under another players name? surely there must be a rule against that?!
as for the whole handling of business from the "The Settlers Online" team. your actions have gone beyond absurd.
you cannot expect people to know what is a bug (and to be able to avoid taking advantage) if you try to cover them up and threaten to ban people who try to report them
if you made a mistake first you apologize and compensate and then move on to other things
you have obviously absolutely no idea how to develop run or administer a game
i am sorely tempted to misplace the storehouses i had ready to give back from minute one just to be excluded from further misery that is The Settlers Online
hehe team BB_Defenders out in force on this one, they been here a few months... their views wiII change in a few years Iike ours have :)
Happy_Santosh
20.07.14, 09:25
HI..questions to BB
1.define fair play..
2.if answer is treating all players action same then......
what about players who got 3 improved store...and those only one...is it fair for them to lo-gin entire month so one receives 3 stores & other only one for your mistake...
So let u demonstrate fairplay:
give 895x2 gems or 2 improves store to players who didn't exploit or get back all exploited improved stores back...let see your fairy play now....
Here the situation... you go to bank withdraw amount.. cashier gives amount...
1.you receive correct amount... (what u worked for u get)
2.you receive x2 x3 amount....(u got more than u deserved but still a cheat)
3.OK now word was out cashier was bad at counting some cashed in there amount many time...(big fraud...)
Inference:
player 1. maintained code of fair play .....
player 2& 3 both exploited although bigger the sin , karma fills up fast so only player3 got noticed ...what about player 2...he cheated but never noticed to recognize him... if u allow them to keep exploited items you don't broke you own rule of fair play (2-3 improved store acceptable 4 means damnation in hell)what rule is that!!!.
seeing above situation... poor fellow player 1 who got 1 store feels cheated...
Also heard players receiving ban threats in mail by settlers online team.. don't you ppl recognize Ur breaking your own rules by threatening a ban if those exploited players not return store...i don't know but it sounds Netiquette...
Man this looks like hollwoodscript lol... BB first think before u act...if u screwing all exploits do all correctly not 4 or more storehouse..
Cheers
Happy :-)
i doubt they will ban the cheaters just a idle threat.. be nice if they did would get rid of half the forum cry baby's and to see the look on their faces when they was banned would be priceless
so, those who exploited the bug should get away with it and those who didn't, get nothing ?
meaning BB should reward cheaters and punish those who play fair ?
LOL
Yperellanios
20.07.14, 10:40
Just trying to figure out if you are naturally daft or just not old enough to know better -_-
12 total posts all in this thread.
CONFIRMED BB spy :P
Yperellanios
20.07.14, 10:52
Also as I see you still haven't read the ToS my dear friend I will quote them for you. Please point me out the point that says I have to be banned:
16.2 Termination of the Account or Services at UBISOFT's initiative
We may suspend or close your Account and your ability to use one or more Services or part of the Services, at any time, automatically and at our sole discretion where:
we have sent by e-mail or by post a formal request to provide us proof of your credentials or to cease an action, behaviour, or breach of these Terms;
it is confirmed or We have reasonable grounds for believing that:
you do not comply with these Terms or any special condition relating to a particular Service or Services;
you are in breach of your legal or contractual obligations;
your Account has been inactive for more than six months and you do not have access to pay functions; or
for any other reason in relation to your use or actions in relation to the Services.
If you have more than one Account, we reserve the right to suspend or close all the Accounts you have opened once one has been suspended or closed under this process.
In the event of a breach of your legal or contractual obligations, we reserve the right to take legal action on grounds of civil or criminal responsibility in order to stop the breach and obtain compensation for our losses. In particular, and without limitation, we reserve the right to prosecute any User who was deliberately damaged or attempted to damage the Services or disrupted the legitimate functioning of the Services or provided assistance for so doing.
I got an extra 2 storehouses, basically by accident. Found them in star and wondered how they got there. I won't be penalised for it as I didn't know about the bug at the time. If I knew, would I of clicked more? Dunno, maybe. Yes I know its morally wrong but given the opportunity I think most ppl would take advantage.
The scene in Superman 3 where the cash machine keeps spewing out free money ( Would u walk away and let the cash just fall to the pavement? )
A fair few ppl have walked away with an extra village school because of the 1st day fiasco, (gutted I wasn't one of them) nothing has been said about that!
I wasn't going to add to this thread, as it was becoming a player v's player slanging match, which is never constructive.
I'm reminded that the written word can often be mis-interpreted depending on the mind set of reader at the time.
Multiple Improved Storehouses
Dear Settlers,
There was a bug when completing the Summer Event calendar.
The main reward (Improved Storehouse) was obtainable multiple times.
Some players acquired 4 or more Improved Storehouses from the calendar, thus exploiting the bug to enrich their accounts.
Since we want players to demonstrate Fair Play and respect the “Terms Of Use”, we ask all players who redeemed 4 or more Improved Storehouses to put them back into the Star menu. They will be deleted from the Star menu during the next maintenance on the 22nd of July.
To me this seems perfectly reasonable and balanced, I have not received a mail so can not comment on the tone of its contents, however in the Q &A part of BB_Ravels announcement I can see how some of it can be interpreted as being `threatening' and ` heavy handed' and somewhat `one sided'. I would like to think that this is just another of those times when is the short comings of the written word.
My concern was the veiled `threat' of a punitive `ban' for non compliance of `not in the interest of Fair Play' ( although I noted it was not expressly stated ) In light of TSO's own conditions regarding `exploits' :
Terms of service states:
Exploits/Cheats
Any discussion or circulation of exploits or cheats is not permitted here, and may lead to exclusion from the service. Cheats and exploits should only be reported to the Support team.
IMO was an error of judgement.
This is compounded by the fact that this was the second time, within the one event, that a bug allowed an exploit to occur with the calendar doors. It is unreasonable to expect the players to take responsibility for what in any other business would be considered
a negligent action by the developers, in not testing the calendar event though to the end, after `fixing' the bug at the beginning.
If BB had worded it with more `Honesty and Responsibility' to the effect:
BB admit that some aspects of the event were not properly tested and implemented and that this has led to some players gaining an unfair advantage over others for which we sincerely apologies. In the spirit of Fair play we would ASK players who have acquired excess of 4 of the intended Improved Storehouse's to move them into Star for removal.......
I think it would have been much better received ;)
I also find its never helpful to compare real life examples to game experiences in dealing with an issue like this. There are plenty of examples within this Forum which would provide more meaningful comparison. The one that springs to mind is the issue of players `accidently clicking on the complete with gems button' , sending a ticket and being told `no refund as it is working as intended'. Is this in the interests of `Fair Play' ? There are many more where the question of Fair Play from BB falls a little short, and so it is no surprise when players feel they should benefit from a BB `mistake'. Is it a question of Morality? or a reflection of the atmosphere between frustrated players and developers?
I hope everybody involved with the game at BB reflect over the summer on how we can all get what we want...Please :)
If you take out 10 imp storehouses and dont get its a bug/exploit you are so stupid you should get banned just for that
Best input in this thread.
I am not really sure what to think about this, there have been plenty of issues in the past where bugs from the test server have been blindly transferred to the normal servers, something needs to be done to improve the bug fixing/tracking so these kind of issues do not arise.
It does not specifically state what will happen to the people who ignore the warning, it just says you will not be banned if you do what is asked, meaning that the people who ignore the warning might get no action taken against them whilst the people who return the storehouses end up losing out for doing the morally correct thing.
In my opinion, a live and learn approach would have been better. If the people who abused the bug can be tracked they why not reward the people who did not abuse it with something which is usually limited on a scale where the bug abusers get nothing. For example, give out a number of free recyclers depending on how many storehouses each player got from the calendar, something like (3 recyclers -(minus) the amount of storehouses given). This way anyone who claimed 3 or more storehouses gets a message along the lines of "We are giving away recyclers to reward players who chose not to abuse bugs, unfortunately you are not eligible as you have been detected as a bug abuser, please do not do this in the future." - no threats of banning, no messing around having to reclaim items you might have got rid of, but a lost opportunity to increase the amount of building for something which is limited.
funkybean2013
20.07.14, 13:23
I agree as NO ONE has stolen anything. In reality they are a fictitious item for a fictitious purpose and BB would not be any lighter in the pocket for the loss of them. I have spent about 1400 quid on this game so a few free items from BB is a welcome sight, and to well over due.
padster007
20.07.14, 14:03
I think people knew that this was a bugged up mistake soon as they got an extra storehouse, then they carried on doing it knowing that something was a matter but still kept it in guilds and cliquey little circles because i never heard about it in the forums or chats until now. but isnt it strange now theres an influx of hate towards bb and settlers because they have to give them back in most cases people who was getting them over and over should face some punishment. Motto of the day, greed is not good.
Thejollyone
20.07.14, 14:07
I havent gained any extra stores from these exploits. Had I known about them, would I have done? LOL yea probably. Its human nature to get something for nothing.
However, now they are asking for them back. That's cool, I would have given them back. But I can only agree with many posts here, you were only ever meant to have one storehouse from this event as a freebie, therefore, all but 1 should be returned.
Not anything other than the 4 or over, as has been officially announced by BB.
That really just doesn't make any sense - you can cheat a bit, but not too much?
Id like to hear BBs logic on this part.
I havent gained any extra stores from these exploits. Had I known about them, would I have done? LOL yea probably. Its human nature to get something for nothing.
However, now they are asking for them back. That's cool, I would have given them back. But I can only agree with many posts here, you were only ever meant to have one storehouse from this event as a freebie, therefore, all but 1 should be returned.
Not anything other than the 4 or over, as has been officially announced by BB.
That really just doesn't make any sense - you can cheat a bit but not too much?
Id like to hear BBs logic on this part.
Hiya Jolly, hope your well? :), Unfortunately this is BB through and through. I received one storehouse (I knew about the exploit) a guild member told me in the dying days of the event. I decided not to test the water but, I have bought a couple of storehouses from the TO since, Does this mean I have 2-3 storehouse on my map now that are the direct result of an exploit? probably! They are level 5 now on my island so no chance they are coming down!!! But what happens if some unaware player by chance has purchased a couple of these from the TO and hasn't yet built them?? Does this then mean this innocent player will lose these if he doesn't place them within the next day or so? probably!!
So people that exploit up to 3 go unpunished, people that exploited it with 4 of more may get some punishment, people who got a free school/floaters have had a result, The innocent people who didn't participate in this again are just out of luck? Its not hard to see who got the short end of the stick is it?
Like many people around here, I'm close to the door marked "exit". Tired of the same old poor distribution of news that matters to the community, updates that are very meh, lack of testing.
@padster007 I can't speak for others, but I know I'm not upset over having to give them back. But when faced with the threat of being banned, I have opted to use what I have to help my friends and guildies come into compliance with the recall and accept the ban for myself, if that is what BB requires of me.
My issue with the situation is the arbitrary nature of them picking this one situation over all others to enforce their "Fair Play" while ignoring others that are just as egregious and/or on-going. For example...
When Dark Brotherhood could be taken out by nukes alone, you probably knew something wasn't quite right. Did you immediately stop doing that adventure when you found the exploit, or did you continue to spam them? And when BB said "this isn't as intended," they didn't recall all Dark Brotherhood loot and threaten with bans.
When people found that they could open all the calendar doors on the first day of the event, they knew they were doing something that wasn't intended. They haven't been threatened with bans nor asked to give back their prizes. In fact, many of those people are exempt from the SH recall/ban because they "only" got 2.
Guilds openly advertise that they will kick and readmit members in order to complete guild quests more quickly, to gain more guild coins. This certainly isn't as intended, yet BB ignores it. Certainly they haven't asked for those extra coins back nor threatened bans.
And goodness knows BB is well on record as saying that blocking wasn't intended.
So why exactly do some exploits get ignored and others allowed to continue, but this particular one generates a ban?
Dear BB ravel,
I totally agree with Larry, how did you let us know about the error so that we will ban the account, and I also want to say that we are not to blame for your mistakes, the game needs to be tested before going into the real world, if you are not noticed this error in the test as it will be in the future, and what kind of example you give to new players who have just started to play, we lose the will to further the game, so you better think before you do anything, you will lose a lot more than you think, not only lose loyal players but also the reputation of the game.
with respect zrikavi
Thejollyone
20.07.14, 15:05
Hiya Jolly, hope your well? :), Unfortunately this is BB through and through. I received one storehouse (I knew about the exploit) a guild member told me in the dying days of the event. I decided not to test the water but, I have bought a couple of storehouses from the TO since, Does this mean I have 2-3 storehouse on my map now that are the direct result of an exploit? probably! They are level 5 now on my island so no chance they are coming down!!! But what happens if some unaware player by chance has purchased a couple of these from the TO and hasn't yet built them?? Does this then mean this innocent player will lose these if he doesn't place them within the next day or so? probably!!
So people that exploit up to 3 go unpunished, people that exploited it with 4 of more may get some punishment, people who got a free school/floaters have had a result, The innocent people who didn't participate in this again are just out of luck? Its not hard to see who got the short end of the stick is it?
Like many people around here, I'm close to the door marked "exit". Tired of the same old poor distribution of news that matters to the community, updates that are very meh, lack of testing.
I am well, my friend :)
Indeed, I have likely gained via trade office from a few "exploited" stores, but that is just trade IMO, there was no way to know for sure how these stores were sourced :)
You have a most valid point, in that the whole event, (and indeed virtually everything else in this game lately) is not tested long enough, or feedback is ignored from said test server. I, and many many more have been banging this drum for a long time now. You can see from the actual feedback pages on test server that many have now given up reporting back due to lack of response... (and thats not off-topic, it would have gone a long way to aiding the smooth running of this event had test been up to the task in hand)
Salem_Warrior_1
20.07.14, 15:37
basicle if you have what not rightfully yours.. BB want um back..the ones who knew the bug and exployted it to thew max know who they are.. no need for the rest of us to worrie. and good on ya BB about time
well what a interested read, myself i got 1 imp' stores at the start and one at the end of the event, I noticed the bug at the start and warned people not
abuse it as it would be a mistake, i knew BB would do something like this because no way they where gonna let you keep all them imp'sto so yeah i sneaked a extra imo
only 1, and left it then so yeah asking for people with more than 4 to pay them all back i say 'Right on BB' you cheated you made that choice to get free imo.
If you see a car parked up with the keys in the ignition does that make it your car. same if a cash machines gives out free money is it yours, a front door is open
and no one is home does that make it ur house . THE ANSWER NO. the imp'sto where not urs to take but you took them, and dam right if u didnt abuse it and only got 1 extra you get to keep it that there way of saying we messed up u can have the extra 1 , but you had 5/6/7/8/9 etc of them Then basically u have stolen them and like anything else where there is a crime there is a punishment.. TY and peace
ah so you got 1 extra and, oh coincidence, 1 extra could be seen as a apology from BB. But if you got more, noooo that would be wrong.
More drama please :)
So many people seem to have missed this vital point it bears repeating:
In game items have no real value. None, nada, worthless. That is BB policy and it is clear, simple and unarguable.
To claim people who got more than their fair share of storehouses are stealing is therefore just plain wrong. You cannot steal something that has no value.
On the topic of responsibility for your own action, maybe some players would consider taking responsibility once BB do so. Lead by example, BB, lead by example.
Exploiting bugs is still exploiting and not allowed in any game. But what I don't get is that people who got 3 instead of the intended 1, can still keep those extra 2...
Where are my extra 2 improved storehouses?
Why do I, a fair player, have to be at a disadvantage compared to people who exploited a bug, accidentallly or not?
I would ask for everyone to be given a total of 3 improved storehouses then, because (and this is not a threat but a fact) I will not pay a single cent anymore for a game that promotes the exploiting of bugs.
If however no compensation takes place, this would be a fine precedent and show us that exploiting bugs in a limited manner is a good thing to do and won't get anyone punished.
ah so you got 1 extra and, oh coincidence, 1 extra could be seen as a apology from BB. But if you got more, noooo that would be wrong.
More drama please :)
one could be seen as a simple miss click or a click from curiosity. To then go back and click a further 10 times is no longer the case, It is then exploiting.
Roll on the 24th I say. Based upon BB's inability to code stuff right first time, I imagine the script they intend to run may do more harm than good. What happens afterwards is anyones guess. Those impacted players that place Improved Storehouses in their Star Menu may see them deleted. It will probably take BB a few days then to agree their global approach to all worlds but in my view despite the veiled suggestion of a ban they haven't come right out and said this so I imagine they wont do anything. Just a simple nod to the conclusion that the individual doesn't support 'Fair Play' and hence maybe may not be looked upon favourably by support in the future.
Personally I would like to see BB do a global ban of accounts but I think its highly improbable and certainly wont be immediate. Looking at the US Forums their maintenance takes place 2 days after ours so I imagine BB will see what impact has happened across all worlds and then decide to do nothing....
Thejollyone
20.07.14, 16:47
Lol if this posts twice i apologise - the web went weird on me
The point is that BB have been inconsistent in their retrieval of so called ill-gotten gains. Either grab back EVERY extra storehouse, or dont do it at all.
Salem_Warrior_1
20.07.14, 18:05
hehe the real funny thing is in software we never own it, it vertual materialism, so we hold nothing and owe nothing. it's BB's to do as they please
BlackBart1982
20.07.14, 18:09
not so if people have spent real money on the game - there is a duty of care for stuff players spend real money on.
However in this case, Im unsure as to if its BBs error or the players who chose to take advantage :)
not so if people have spent real money on the game - there is a duty of care for stuff players spend real money on.
However in this case, Im unsure as to if its BBs error or the players who chose to take advantage :)
Salem is correct, Ive been playing mmo's since Ultima online, It has always been this way, The game provider reserves all intellectual rights. At no point do we "own" anything that BB supply us.
It works the same way with flixster too, if you breach their TOS they close your account and that's it, I am not sure with ITunes as I don't really use them, But I can see them working the same way too.
BlackBart1982
20.07.14, 18:49
In which case I will never, ever spend real money on this or any other online game... There must be a law in place to ensure our rights as consumers are protected...
Pretty sure it works the same way with playstation network and xbox live, if you breech their tos, they can ban your account, any games or content you bought off of the live marketplace, say goodbye to it.
For other bugs and that became a disaster for gamers BB silence....WHY????? There because BB did not fair play? Not when the mistake is yours to pay .. and why not send them one day after; Is something suspicious here;;;
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
20.07.14, 19:53
When Dark Brotherhood could be taken out by nukes alone, you probably knew something wasn't quite right. Did you immediately stop doing that adventure when you found the exploit, or did you continue to spam them? And when BB said "this isn't as intended," they didn't recall all Dark Brotherhood loot and threaten with bans.
The DB nuke thing gave players that gained certain loot via adventure the ability to use them, This game is based on island economy and military tactics to progress using 3 Nukes on 1 camp to clear a sector or adventure is no different to blocking a camp or only attacking certain leader camps to clear a sector or sending 1 general with 1 R to make a kill and obtain loot.
If blocking wasn't intended BB would remove all guides from the forum that used blocks, and would implement some sort of coding to prevent it, i.e the change the duration of an attack.
No BB didn't recall the loot, they changed the coding so you can't do it anymore. Why did they not recall the loot ? because it was in game content, to my knowledge a 750 gem building is not attainable in game.
Don't try and compare the to because they are by no way comparative, it's like saying a player that performs no blocks but doesn't clear every camp on an adventure is in breach of ToS, therefore ineligible to the loot.
When people found that they could open all the calendar doors on the first day of the event, they knew they were doing something that wasn't intended. They haven't been threatened with bans nor asked to give back their prizes. In fact, many of those people are exempt from the SH recall/ban because they "only" got 2.
The calendar doors you had to use gems to open, not matter what the date. If you were to open them all on the first night, as people i know did, it would have cost you 600 gems.
Guilds openly advertise that they will kick and readmit members in order to complete guild quests more quickly, to gain more guild coins. This certainly isn't as intended, yet BB ignores it. Certainly they haven't asked for those extra coins back nor threatened bans.
Players who join guilds do under the guidelines set out by that guild, the primary object of being in a guild is to obtain guild coins as via completion of the quests. If certain players are holding others up or discontinued their involvement in TSO then a guide will remove them as per their guidelines. If a player is a sporadic player and gets booted then maybe they should to be in a guild.
The reason they picked this one situation is because of repeated transgressions that occurred: if a player logged in e
very 10 minutes and got 1 storehouse over the cost of the 12 hour period that's 72 storehouses.
Yes, theft is theft, but the punishment also fits the crime. BB did not demand 60k gc's worth of loot worth a recall, they did 54k's worth of gem based storehouses, which is what 1 player could have obtained in a 12 hour period.
awww *heart swells* I got response love from the baaahman. Normally, I would not get into a nitpicking match since neither one of us will change the other's mind, and I'm far from taking any moral superiority stance, as so many others have tried to take, but I can't pass up a chance to go head to head against you.
The vast majority of players are in the same boat, regardless of whether they took the SHs or not. The common thread throughout those who are pro-ban is that the extra SHs were "not intended" by BB and therefore those who took them should have known better. The thing is though that there are many things that weren't intended by BB that players exploit so commonly and which have been allowed by BB for so long that players forget that they maybe aren't quite so innocent of using exploits as they think. The examples cited were just a small sample of exploits ignored or forgiven by BB, chosen to highlight the discrepancy in the responses they give.
The nukes used for the DB exploit could be won in adventure loot or purchased in the Epic shop for in-game resources. To highlight that this exploit wasn't as intended, BB changed the coding so it could no longer be done, just the same as they changed the coding so that the SHs could no longer be claimed. If you had taken advantage of this DB exploit, you were allowed to keep your gains, but I am being threatened with a ban. You liken it to blocking, suggesting that blocking is supported by BB but our former CM Dantesama states outright here (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/22665-Feedback-Generals-jumping-forward-and-getting-intercepted?p=214904&viewfull=1#post214904) they do not. They simply choose to accept this exploit. (as a side note, as you say this is an island economy and military tactics game. The benefits of receiving full epic adventure loot with no military cost, no rebuilding time and small resource cost far outweigh the convenience benefit of more storage space)
Guilds are of course going to set their own standards for activity and quest completion. While I have not seen an official statement from BB on this particular topic, I find it hard to believe that they encourage or intended guilds to use the kick feature to force optimal quest completion, nor do I think they would look kindly on the guilds which actively promote themselves as using this tactic. Since my initial post which mentioned this issue, at least two guilds on our server have edited their messages in the Guild List to remove their statements about this. I find that interesting.
As you say, "theft is theft" yet you justify the taking of thousands of gems' worth of resources, buffs, event items, and limited-purchase buildings as well as a storehouse for the low low price of 600 gems as being acceptable and unworthy of punishment? Last I checked, the SHs could be traded freely in game, but those limited purchase floaters and schools, not so much. And the hundreds of extra footballs and event resources gained gave those players a big head start in the event and allowed for account enriching beyond what was intended.
Oh, and for what its worth, technically there has been no breach of the TOS. The TOS protects them against complaint if they do decide to ban, but that will fall into their catchall clause which allows account termination for any reason at any time. Further, there is no breach of the In Game Rules and Code of Conduct as posted here (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/21679-In-game-Rules-Code-of-conduct-%28chat-and-forum%29). While I am sure this will be amended shortly, there is currently no prohibition against using what is given to everyone in game. It is forbidden to advertise them (as with the guilds and their kicking practices) but not against using them. Its a technicality, but still it is what it is.
TL : DR-- BB has a diverse range of responses to activities which can be seen as exploitations. If they choose to ban for taking the SH, as they are well within their rights to do, then there are some other exploits that they should be looking into as well. Cheers!
Congratulations BB, another fine mess! You may call some elements of the community 'cheaters' and 'hackers', but let me suggest that you are comprehensively 'incompetent'.
I personally have not received a warning mail.
This game is going downhill rapidly. BB, why not invest your time into developing the game such as the two-year overdue level 50 content and testing it properly rather than alienating the game's community with threats over your rubbish coding?
This episode is another reminder of why I have stopped buying gems! Why continue to give my money to a gaming company that ignores what I and many others ask for, instead delivering what they want to, which has little benefit to anyone.
Until you introduce new level 50 content such as the long overdue promised PVP, level 50+, new high-level adventures I will not purchase a single gem!
BAAAHHHHHJJJAAA
21.07.14, 03:46
@Foof
Ohh Twinkle toes, bless your cotton socks , with regard to the DB thing all i shall say is this: "Two wrongs don't make a right" :P
padster007
21.07.14, 03:54
lol or in this case 2 storehouses dont make a right ;P
Bullllhead
21.07.14, 05:38
There are many of us who pay a significant amount of $$ to play this game and we endeavour to overlook the continuation of bugs particularly during events.
Although I personally don 't have sympathy for those who have exploited the bug in this instance, it doesn't matter... BB's decision to set an absolute and arbitrary level of contravention is illogical. It would either be all or nothing, so just back off and make it nothing. Making people give these ISHs back is just as silly as exploiting the bug in the first place.
One more thing, since the game is no longer in beta as a paying player I know that I would personally appreciate more effective effort on BB's part to actually roll out events without a major bug, because up to this point after a full 2 years I have yet to see an event that doesn't contain something major such as this.
Do the right thing BB, please learn from your mistakes and work harder to ensure that events are rolled out without these potentially divisive mistakes that serve to tear the fabric of our player community apart and potentially cause players to leave the game.
And as for those of you who are bug exploiters.... how about reporting the bug immediately upon discovery and helping BB make our game an ever improving place to play.
Hi
I wanna start off by thanking everyone that posted in this thread, I enjoyed my coffee at work reading all this was so worth reading.
My opinion is yes, a exploit took place, but why is BB reacting so harshly now?
I remember the gold mine exploit, the impact of that exploit still effect the game till now, people was able to refill gold mines at a fraction of the real cost for weeks on end, I once saw a person with 6 gold mines having 1.2mil gold ore in EACH... yet he didnt get banned?
All this shows to me is that BB is just losing control and not testing there software, its sad because I myself pay for this game and I can just see my hard spend money go down the drain as BB just does not care if there software works or not, as long as its launched in time for there 200% gem sales they are happy campers.
I am glad BB is taking some action against people exploiting and abusing bugs, but I am a sound believer in "human nature" you can't stop people from exploiting if you don't test your software... however, you could test your software better? I mean of EVERYTHING that was tested, no one bothered to look if you could open the same window TWICE ? To me that's like buying a new car and not checking if it has wheels on...
I personally would just sweep this under the rug, BB this is embarrassing to say the least, I would find a rock and crawl under it if I was a BB staff and if I was a developer or a tester.. I would look at my life again and try to figure out where I went wrong.
I do hope justice takes place, both on the player side and on BB side.
The only point I agree on is someone said "that's why I don't buy gems anymore", I feel the same, I stopped buying gems simply because its a waste of money, it clearly goes to uneducated people and lazy testers that doesn't deserve my money.
Enjoy
Rislem
And as for those of you who are bug exploiters.... how about reporting the bug immediately upon discovery and helping BB make our game an ever improving place to play.
It happened at the weekend. Nobody to report to. And reports on the forums were deleted and the posters threatened with bans.
however, you could test your software better? I mean of EVERYTHING that was tested, no one bothered to look if you could open the same window TWICE ? To me that's like buying a new car and not checking if it has wheels on...
I personally would just sweep this under the rug, BB this is embarrassing to say the least, I would find a rock and crawl under it if I was a BB staff and if I was a developer or a tester.. I would look at my life again and try to figure out where I went wrong.
Yes. I think if there was even a hint that BB are going to reflect on their innumerable errors during this event and do something to ensure something like it doesn't happen again, then people would be far more accepting of the heavyhandedness of this response.
I played an online game that recently shut down.
They gave (about) 3 months notice that ALL worlds would be terminated, even newly started ones.
Lots of people complained about wanting the money back that they had put into the game just before the announcement was given. Company response: 'You have 3 months, enjoy what you bought.'
You are not paying for items - you are basically paying for a service, and you don't have to.
As for being called a 'hack or cheat' - I didn't see that, I only see that the communications are supposed to go to the 'hack or cheat' support form.
Mannerheim
21.07.14, 09:00
It happened at the weekend. Nobody to report to. And reports on the forums were deleted and the posters threatened with bans.
Did you report it to support?
German forums have more detailed info (Google translate):
Also in this case we must insist on return of 3 warehouses. If you have reported the calendar errors on Saturday, the support, we can assume that it is not a "Bug-Using." In this case, please send a message to our support . Select the "Cheat & Hack" category and the subject "Improved warehouse exploit" and about mittele your original ticket number as proof. Nevertheless, three warehouses are deleted from your account. This automatic deletion is not "exceptions" customizable. Therefore, we will be in the support ticket you find a solution for.
Also:
To take advantage of the mistake, it was necessary the corresponding button in the calendar active to click log out, some time to wait, and repeat the procedure.
Why the game was not switched off when becoming aware of the error?
This particular game error could only be exploited when it deliberately and with premeditation did. The warehouses did not fly by itself in a plural number in the star menu. A shutdown of the game would have but for many players means their island Saturdays not being able to attend. Apart from the nuisance, other consequences would then again have been drawn, for example, collapsed mines, because a visit to the island was not possible. The game is only switched off when otherwise are game data in danger of being destroyed (zone errors, lost game progress, etc.).
http://forum.diesiedleronline.de/threads/109790-Mehrfache-Verbesserte-Lagerh%E4user-Teil-II?p=1041773#post1041773
Did you report it to support?
From your post copying the extra info from the DE forums it would suggest that support knew about it but were unable/unwilling to do anything about it.
We therefore come back to the same point: exactly what benefit would there be to anyone to simply clog up support's inbox with more reports? None! So why are people saying this should have been reported to support? Urinating into the wind...
Also a similar refusal to acknowledge any error at all on the German forums:
from the FAQ
Q. Why do not you give us the warehouses, it was your fault!
A. Every warehouse in the game that is not intended to be there messes up the balance. Not only are warehouses traded, it also reduces their "value" for future events. Moreover, it is difficult to explain why a player may, for example, 10 retain Improved warehouses, but others were honest and only one or two got.
Doesn't answer the question now, does it?
Just admit you made a mistake BB. It's getting pathetic.
Note also the confirmation of one key point I have been banging on about: the word "value" is put in quotes. These items don't have any real value.
One final quote from the FAQ:
The entire issue was discussed about 50 rounds since Friday afternoon, with always the same arguments. Who really have anything new to say, may be involved, everything has already been said to be non-redundant posted again and again.
Basically, "what we've said is final". Just like the decision to push ahead with a buggy event despite all the feedback that it wasn't even close to being ready. What is the point of the test server if you're just going to make up your own minds anyway, and you have proved time and again that your minds are weak...
iread all posts most of them are not to give storehouses .ihave mine in star menu . what ppl will do just wait to ban them?do i have to wait also for tommorow see if i am banned?if not give them
Mannerheim
21.07.14, 11:32
BB knew about it midday on Saturday and had people working on a no downtime fix which they got done later on same day. If people would have contacted support and waited for the reply on Monday what to do, can they use or sell the extra they would have less problems now. Support is for issue tracking. Even if they know about stuff they get metrics of most common problems or emergency situations. Less reports, less priority. Posting it to forums would have spread the damage.
Instead some people exploited like no tomorrow and some less, trade filled with storehouses being tried to be money laundered. Anyone who clicks to get the storehouse, logs out for 15 min to get game status in semi-passive mode and then relogins and repeats over 4 times in 12h and thinks there is nothing wrong or weird happening is stupid or ignorant that they should be banned just for that.
Players have some responsibility too even if BB sucks at bug testing. However BB should get their news posting up to date and communicate better. It took almost a week to get info about this to players even tho they knew about the problem same day it happened. Where was the front page post/warning about calendar problem during weekend?
so i let them to star menu for tommorow i dont want to be out of game for some stores i am over 2 years on sttlers
Haven't read the thread, way too big, just chipping in my two-penneth.
Obtaining more than one storehouse may have been innocent and accidental which is why they're not calling for everyone who got more than one to give all of them back. Obtaining more than the number they specified in this ban mail was a result of repetition of the same procedure and at that point the procedure was clearly unintentional, therefore that is the textbook definition of exploitation.
Yes it was their flaw but that argument could be used to support any and all exploitation. For example, if I managed to get 10,000 coins by some repeating some nefarious procedure over and over when I realise I can get 100 free coins I'm exploiting that flaw, would a valid defence be the flaw shouldn't exist for me to exploit it..? I don't think so. You don't like my speedhack and aimbot in your multiplayer FPS ? Well I should be able to build one, I shouldn't be penalised for using your flaw! ... It just doesn't work as a defence.
If you did something and you got a free imp. storehouse out of it and you repeated that mistake you would be repeating that mistake deliberately to benefit from it... If the mistake blew up a lvl5 Exotic Wood sawmill instead of giving you a free imp. storehouse would you do it again or would you learn from that first mistake ?
I really don't see the problem in giving back what obviously wasn't on offer.
Yperellanios
21.07.14, 13:34
I would be willing to give back the storehouses under 2 conditions:
1. BB should admit their mistake FIRST. After all it's THEIR mistake that allowed me and other players to do this not mine. If they had tested their game properly before release this wouldn't have happened.
2. They should refrain from calling people "cheaters" and "hackers" and threatening with bans. There is a civilized way to communicate and I think a company like BB would have at least someone that can write a polite text asking for the storehouses back and not some bs like "GIVE THEM BACK CHEATERS OR WE WILL BAN YOU"
As long as the 2 conditions do not apply I will NOT return the storehouses to my star menu. If they decide to ban me so be it. I will not tolerate bullying of any sort especially from people that are guilty themselves. I will be happy to spend my money in another game.
Mannerheim wrote:
Anyone who clicks to get the storehouse, logs out for 15 min to get game status in semi-passive mode and then relogins and repeats over 4 times in 12h and thinks there is nothing wrong or weird happening is stupid or ignorant that they should be banned just for that.
I don't know how the game is working over on Newfoundland, but I often have to refresh, log in log out ( 15mins or 30mins as the fix recommended here on forum) just to get some of the game to work, quite often more than 4 times in a much shorter than 12hr time span, I know there is something wrong and weird happening, its called bad programming/server ability and/or game development. I don't see why after enduring all this to get my Settler fix I should be banned for it and called stupid....addicted, lonely and sad I don't mind, but please not stupid :D:D:D
Further more, who created all this multiple clicking of buttons in the first place? If it appears in TSO it must require multiple clicks, whether its worth it or not, who are we to argue, arguing costs us valuable clicking time :)
Splotch wrote:
I really don't see the problem in giving back what obviously wasn't on offer.
I do, the Devs will continue to produce a sub standard game with no consequences sticking at their door. From the moment I saw this mentioned I thought to myself nice side step BB ;).
I wonder how much time and effort is being spent repairing this event ( script to remove storehouses from star ) to cover up the inadequacy of the original coding and testing, let alone the `fix' which was applied at the beginning of the event. Beside which these are storehouses not production buildings, their effect on server `economies' is very limited, some have argued that giving away the Gold tower was far more damaging in the short term to server economies.....and that was BB driven :rolleyes:
ps. I thought that the change in entrance to the imp. storehouse as seen on test was another bug....but perhaps its a Dev revenge to punish ALL the player base for the few that have shown up their shortcomings :p
I really don't see the problem in giving back what obviously wasn't on offer.
I do, the Devs will continue to produce a sub standard game with no consequences sticking at their door. From the moment I saw this mentioned I thought to myself nice side step BB ;).
As I said in the rest of my post, just because a bug exists it is not an excuse for exploiting it... If you think that people exploiting the bug to get multiple improved storehouses is a viable way to express frustration that the game is "sub standard" then you only have to look at the outcome to see if it's effective... It isn't, they've got to give them back and I'd hazard a guess that next time those same people wont be getting a friendly warning to give back their ill-gotten gains.
Beside which these are storehouses not production buildings, their effect on server `economies' is very limited.
That much is true, their impact when used is virtually zero as far as the player driven economy goes with the only notable benefit being the ability to list larger stacks on the TO. However, that doesn't change the fact that some players exploited the bug to get storehouses, they then sold those on for pure profit and that's where this kind of thing most certainly does hurt the playerbase at large... Whoever exploited that bug and sold those structures gained an unfair advantage over those who didn't.
How about if I cheated and conjured myself up 100k gold coins via an exploit ? Would you have any problem with me keeping that considering it's worth the sale price of about 7 imp. storehouses ? How about if we factor in that by cheating like that I could switch my Golden Tower off for a year and, relatively speaking, even if everyone buffed theirs 24/7 for a year they'd only just be catching up on what I'd done a year down the line ?
Bigger picture dude... Bigger picture.
I would be willing to give back the storehouses under 2 conditions:
1. BB should admit their mistake FIRST. After all it's THEIR mistake that allowed me and other players to do this not mine. If they had tested their game properly before release this wouldn't have happened.
They have stated it as a bug, so yes.. They have admit their mistake.
2. They should refrain from calling people "cheaters" and "hackers" and threatening with bans. There is a civilized way to communicate and I think a company like BB would have at least someone that can write a polite text asking for the storehouses back and not some bs like "GIVE THEM BACK CHEATERS OR WE WILL BAN YOU"
As long as the 2 conditions do not apply I will NOT return the storehouses to my star menu. If they decide to ban me so be it. I will not tolerate bullying of any sort especially from people that are guilty themselves. I will be happy to spend my money in another game.
They have not called anyone "cheaters" and "hackers". Just pointing people to "contact the Support team. Choose the category "Cheat & Hack" and write "Improved Storehouse Exploit" in the subject field".
Now I've read a mail sent from BB to a player who redeemed 4 or more storehouses.. That mail is in no way threatening, but quite polite.. Thou I admit it's pretty absurd way to deal with it - as I've already mentioned, they could have handled it a lot better.
However, the way many players are behaving here it's really like they knew they did something they shouldn't and now expect the worst out of it.
Mannerheim
21.07.14, 15:15
I don't know how the game is working over on Newfoundland, but I often have to refresh, log in log out ( 15mins or 30mins as the fix recommended here on forum) just to get some of the game to work, quite often more than 4 times in a much shorter than 12hr time span, I know there is something wrong and weird happening, its called bad programming/server ability and/or game development. I don't see why after enduring all this to get my Settler fix I should be banned for it and called stupid....addicted, lonely and sad I don't mind, but please not stupid :D:D:D
When someone is clicking to get the storehouse for the 4th time in short time span and does not think there is anything wrong it's plain stupidity or ignorance.
When someone knows from the past there is bad programming involved and bugs every now and then in this game and clicks the storehouse for the 4th time in short time span is plain exploiter. There is not much between here.
Also anyone who clicked one extra storehouse at the start (it was available for very short time) of event and then continued clicking more than 1-2 at the end is plain exploiter as they spammed the calendar problem news in-game and front page at start.
Bullllhead
21.07.14, 15:21
Perhaps there is another way to look at it... for those of us who joined while the game was in formal beta finding and exploiting the bugs was often the fastest way to promote positive and effective action. :)
In the end I am puzzled by BB's stance on this as it swings past a fair, moderate response and nibbles on a draconic edge and then in an arbitrary fashion regarding the level of contravention. Again, while I don't have any sympathy for those who knowingly exploited the bug it doesn't matter... stop rolling out events with major bugs in them.
They have stated it as a bug, so yes.. They have admit their mistake.
They have said there was a bug, they didn't say it was theirs. They could be blaming Flash for interpreting their coding wrong! And they certainly haven't apologised for this bug or any of the others that littered the event.
That's exactly what the people saying they should be able to keep their 5 storehouses are doing. They admit to having got lots of storehouses, but make no apologies for it and aren't going to do anything themselves about it.
BB should take responsibility for their mistake first and perhaps show people they've learned a lesson or two from their myriad failures. Then there might be an argument that the people who exploited the bug should give their ill-gotten gains back. At present, I'm not seeing any reason to support BB's position in this because BB are not being fair to the players and show no signs of being fair in the future - that's the "bigger picture" here.
Changing tack slighty, I personally think it must have been a bug that rain of arrows and other non-event buffs could be used to remove football camps. It wasn't mentioned in the info about the event, so presumably wasn't intentional, so presumably everyone who used rain of arrows was exploiting a bug and should either give back all the items they obtained from the football shop or be banned in the interests of fairness.
[LIST]
When someone is clicking to get the storehouse for the 4th time in short time span and does not think there is anything wrong it's plain stupidity or ignorance.
And what words would you choose to describe the programmer/playtester who leaves such a gaping hole in their product?
At present, I'm not seeing any reason to support BB's position in this because BB are not being fair to the players and show no signs of being fair in the future - that's the "bigger picture" here.
Not really, that's still pretty short sighted for the reasons I stated.
If you're not siding with BB then fair enough, couldn't really care less about that part of it myself because that's not the issue... What doesn't make any sense is siding with a bunch of people that used an exploit to gain multiple imp. storehouses that could then be sold on for profit giving them an advantage over those that either didn't know or didn't use the exploit - that is the bigger picture.
I'd understand your stance if everyone got more than four and everyone had to give them back, that would at least be balanced and fair for the entire playerbase but that's not the case here. Even the people who get to keep four of however many they managed to milk are going to gain an advantage, that advantage devalues what those who didn't use the exploit do in game... Those that didn't use the exploit are now playing catch up to those that did so if your issue is that BB isn't being fair then I'd say you should also take issue with the unfairness in keeping those imp. storehouses too, unless you think it's fair ?
Not really, that's still pretty short sighted for the reasons I stated.
You haven't given any good reasons at all. You said that if the bug had been far worse or had been exploitable for more profit BB would be justified to be heavy handed.
I've not seen an argument that a few extra storehouses is a big deal. Only BB are making it a big deal. But they're NOT also making a big deal of their failings, which is unforgivable.
And it's a 1-player experience. What do I care if someone is doing better than me? The complete "meh" at the introduction of the achivement system and being able to compare achievements with other players just goes to prove that.
Mannerheim
21.07.14, 16:06
And what words would you choose to describe the programmer/playtester who leaves such a gaping hole in their product?
A one without job now or in future.
Test server and BB ability read feedback there has been a fiasco for long time now. New mail system or other features have been rolled out to live in Polish servers and then rolled back to old system cause with the horrible bugs. They have lost tons of man hours on unneeded maintenance's, support, etc. damage control.
Even if we ignore test server completely for a second. How is it possible that calendar storage-multiclick was not properly fixed and re-tested after first day incident? there's something horribly wrong with BB workflow. Either there are useless middle management guys skipping important things or preventing the team use time on things or some of the in-house test or dev team does not do their work. Someones head will get chopped off in the end if not happened already.
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 16:08
LMAO Im gonna stir it up again as I truly didnt realise how the bug worked until reading the forum more.
All those who took major advantage of the bug knew what they were doing - no excuses, end of... You can spout previous Beta bugs, normal bugs, weekend bugs all you want - fact is you were greedy and took advantage, there is no excuse for that.
Now is the time to face up to the fact you got caught. Pay them back one way or another. I have no sympathy - you logged in and out and continually took advantage. Grow up and face the penalty.
padster007
21.07.14, 16:19
lol totally agree on that one, people arguing over getting extra goodies more than others. not fair people whinging about paying so much into the game, they are others who pay just as much who didnt know, so its ok for sneaky paying users to get more than loyal non cheating users then?
BB should take responsibility for their mistake first and perhaps show people they've learned a lesson or two from their myriad failures. Then there might be an argument that the people who exploited the bug should give their ill-gotten gains back. At present, I'm not seeing any reason to support BB's position in this because BB are not being fair to the players and show no signs of being fair in the future - that's the "bigger picture" here.
Exactly how would that "show" look like? What I've seen in this forum there's plenty of players that wouldn't find any excuse good enough..
I'm not supporting BB's position in this either, but I'm getting tired of the whining spam here. Especially those containing lies.
LMAO Im gonna stir it up again as I truly didnt realise how the bug worked until reading the forum more.
All those who took major advantage of the bug knew what they were doing - no excuses, end of... You can spout previous Beta bugs, normal bugs, weekend bugs all you want - fact is you were greedy and took advantage, there is no excuse for that.
Now is the time to face up to the fact you got caught. Pay them back one way or another. I have no sympathy - you logged in and out and continually took advantage. Grow up and face the penalty.
Exactly :) Same as real life, accountability, Anyone who doesn't return them should be at the mercy of BB.
Few years back there was a bug with fifa 09/10/11 cant remember what one, Gold pack collectable cards (online variety) A way to get free packs, As many as you wanted!!! I knew about this bug too, Again I didn't participate but everyone who did went bye bye very quickly :) theft is theft.
OK, I admit I missed a good argument for BB to want the storehouses back: people who have paid money and didn't benefit from the bug would be justifiably upset.
I just didn't see that argument because I've always been too sensible not to pay any money into this game. It's a beta game in everything but name as this entire thread proves. I don't pay money for beta-standard products and it's up to BB to improve their standards.
EDIT, but I'll repeat one last time for the hard of hearing - these storehouses have no real value. you can't steal something that has no value.
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 16:42
OK, I admit I missed a good argument for BB to want the storehouses back: people who have paid money and didn't benefit from the bug would be justifiably upset.
I just didn't see that argument because I've always been too sensible not to pay any money into this game. It's a beta game in everything but name as this entire thread proves. I don't pay money for beta-standard products and it's up to BB to improve their standards.
EDIT, but I'll repeat one last time for the hard of hearing - these storehouses have no real value. you can't steal something that has no value.
Soz I just dont understand your comment? People have blatantly cheated time and time again. How an anyone justify this? Its a case of repeat cheating which is an offence..
EDIT, but I'll repeat one last time for the hard of hearing - these storehouses have no real value. you can't steal something that has no value.
Yes, you're right! Improved stores have absolutely no value at all...
Apart from the 15kgc you can get on the TO for them meaning four free ones nets you about 60,000 coins. Which equates to well over a hundred lvl3 > lvl4 upgrades which in turn increases your productivity and buff efficiency. :rolleyes:
I swear I said "bigger picture" a while back.
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 16:46
"EDIT, but I'll repeat one last time for the hard of hearing - these storehouses have no real value. you can't steal something that has no value."
But they do have value - they are purchasable from the merchant for gems!!!
Soz I just dont understand your comment? People have blatantly cheated time and time again. How an anyone justify this? Its a case of repeat cheating which is an offence..
The point is that there is no reason for anyone to get upset about people who exploited the bug and obtained something that has no value. The point is that there is absolutely no reason for BB to alienate a large proportion of their playerbase by demanding the return of storehouses.
UNLESS
you realise that some people have already made a mistake buying spending their real life money on gems... Those people, faced with the fact that they've made a terrible mistake spending money on this sub-standard game, are justifiably upset and since those people pay BBs barely earned wages, BB had to try to get their worthless storehouses back again somehow.
No value to us, true, I'm pretty sure the shareholders wouldn't share your view.
"EDIT, but I'll repeat one last time for the hard of hearing - these storehouses have no real value. you can't steal something that has no value."
But they do have value - they are purchasable from the merchant for gems!!!
As soon as the real money gets turned into gems, the content has no value. That is BB policy. Perhaps you missed my explanation of this back on page 1 or 2 of this thread.
If they had value, you could get a refund. If they had value, BB are breaking any number of trading laws.
EDIT
Let's explain this another way.
When you spend money on this game, buying gems, you're paying for entertainment. You're paying for a service, not a product. The in game items entertain you, but have no value of themselves. If you gain no entertainment from having the items then you have made a bad investment of your money.
If you think your investment was buying a "thing" in a game, you have misunderstood the nature of the transaction.
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 16:54
OK maybe I have perhaps missed a point - but as business goes Im pretty sure that BB are quite within their rights on this particular occasion to demand items back that were never intended to be obtained in such a manner.
750 gems per storehouse? Its a huge hit to take when some greedy people who gained are now going to flood the market, thus shortening BBs potential profit.
As soon as the real money gets turned into gems, the content has no value. That is BB policy. Perhaps you missed my explanation of this back on page 1 or 2 of this thread.
If they had value, you could get a refund. If they had value, BB are breaking any number of trading laws.
But they do have a value to BB/UBI/Shareholders, Via covering the operating costs or generating dividends.
can someone tell me tommorow how many players will be on line i think its over 50% that we exploit and took a lot of stores ?because i havent read many they want to return them
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 17:06
I think the ban part will be dependant on how many stores certain people had (i.e the seriousness of the "crime")
I would hope that the ban part was just a scare to get a lot of people to return their ill gotten gains.
However, as a serious cash playing player, I stand by my earlier post in that I hope there will be some retribution for thiose who still took the pi$$
EDIT - having said that - yea I would surely have taken the pish too had I known about it - Im a hypocrite to the extreme ;)
OK maybe I have perhaps missed a point - but as business goes Im pretty sure that BB are quite within their rights on this particular occasion to demand items back that were never intended to be obtained in such a manner.
750 gems per storehouse? Its a huge hit to take when some greedy people who gained are now going to flood the market, thus shortening BBs potential profit.
But they do have a value to BB/UBI/Shareholders, Via covering the operating costs or generating dividends.
Except that BB have been sensible enough not to play the money/value/profit card. Because they know these things are worthless.
Instead, they've played the "fair play" card.
I only mentioned the lack of value of these things because other people keep on equating exploitation of this bug with theft to justify their position that BB are in the right. This is an incorrect comparison and, I repeat, not one that BB have made because they know their own policy on this.
They've gone for "fair play" because they understand that people are buying entertainment and, for those people, someone else getting that same entertainment for free sullies their enjoyment. They don't need these things back and having a few extra storehouses on the market isn't actually going to change their profits one jot, I would guess.
What they are doing, and this is the argument I failed to see until a couple of pages back, is protecting the emotional wellbeing of the people who have invested money into this game.
Any argument about cheating/stealing etc is just wrong. It's not about punishing the cheaters, it's about making the gem-buyers feel better so they keep on spending.
I think the ban part will be dependant on how many stores certain people had (i.e the seriousness of the "crime")
I would hope that the ban part was just a scare to get a lot of people to return their ill gotten gains.
However, as a serious cash playing player, I stand by my earlier post in that I hope there will be some retribution for thiose who still took the pi$$
Agreed, my only real concern is this could actually affect people who have bought stores from the TO and played no part in the exploit. I hope there is a contingency plan for these players, I doubt it thou :(
Thejollyone
21.07.14, 17:14
I did say earlier in the thread that the play fair thing was at fault. IMO return all or nothing.
I do however stand by my previous posts - you knew you took advantage and you must pay it back on this occasion. I admit if I knew about it I would have done what a few have done. Would I have done it to such a level? No... Maybe...
We all want free stuff, we take it to the max. But you also know at that point you do it, you are "cheating" by getting something for nothing. Would I hand it back to BB? Hell yes cos I would know I was wrong and got caught...
The protesters are revealing a picture of themselves and it ain't a pretty one.
padster007
21.07.14, 17:16
@padster007 I can't speak for others, but I know I'm not upset over having to give them back. But when faced with the threat of being banned, I have opted to use what I have to help my friends and guildies come into compliance with the recall and accept the ban for myself, if that is what BB requires of me.
My issue with the situation is the arbitrary nature of them picking this one situation over all others to enforce their "Fair Play" while ignoring others that are just as egregious and/or on-going. For example...
When Dark Brotherhood could be taken out by nukes alone, you probably knew something wasn't quite right. Did you immediately stop doing that adventure when you found the exploit, or did you continue to spam them? And when BB said "this isn't as intended," they didn't recall all Dark Brotherhood loot and threaten with bans.
When people found that they could open all the calendar doors on the first day of the event, they knew they were doing something that wasn't intended. They haven't been threatened with bans nor asked to give back their prizes. In fact, many of those people are exempt from the SH recall/ban because they "only" got 2.
Guilds openly advertise that they will kick and readmit members in order to complete guild quests more quickly, to gain more guild coins. This certainly isn't as intended, yet BB ignores it. Certainly they haven't asked for those extra coins back nor threatened bans.
And goodness knows BB is well on record as saying that blocking wasn't intended.
So why exactly do some exploits get ignored and others allowed to continue, but this particular one generates a ban?
thing is i think i found that out about the DBs with a guild member but i didnt hide it i put it straight into the trade tab for sale, so i never tried to hide the DB easy route i was open about it and put it in the open for all to see. but then again i maybe wasnt the 1st to do the easy route on a DB and they was some other sneaky players keeping it for themselves, if you think your doing no wrong then what is there to hide? ;)
and the thing about people who kick members for not doing guild quests thats up to them if they put it in the write up when recruiting for there guild,i blame the members for not abiding by the guild owners rules as surely they can read what is expected from them :)
Except that BB have been sensible enough not to play the money/value/profit card. Because they know these things are worthless.
Instead, they've played the "fair play" card.
I only mentioned the lack of value of these things because other people keep on equating exploitation of this bug with theft to justify their position that BB are in the right. This is an incorrect comparison and, I repeat, not one that BB have made because they know their own policy on this.
They've gone for "fair play" because they understand that people are buying entertainment and, for those people, someone else getting that same entertainment for free sullies their enjoyment. They don't need these things back and having a few extra storehouses on the market isn't actually going to change their profits one jot, I would guess.
What they are doing, and this is the argument I failed to see until a couple of pages back, is protecting the emotional wellbeing of the people who have invested money into this game.
Any argument about cheating/stealing etc is just wrong. It's not about punishing the cheaters, it's about making the gem-buyers feel better so they keep on spending.
None of us know how much, Even most BB staff wouldn't know how much, Information could be gained from the AGM or the annual financial report, Regardless of the exact amount, This content does have a value in one way or another. Its lost future revenue than anything more.
I haven't actually seen one of these emails, So I couldn't speculate on the contents of it. But if BB said it was because of "fair play" then I guess that's true, because I have 100% faith in BB, at all times :)
The point is that there is no reason for anyone to get upset about people who exploited the bug and obtained something that has no value.
But they do have value!
Sit two mid-twenty level players down in a room together and give one of them four improved storehouses and give the other nothing. If what you're saying is true and they are completely valueless then the player that got them wouldn't mind giving the player that didn't get them all four of the improved store houses... Would they ?
If you think that they don't have any value at all then you wont mind if you go ahead and destroy all of the ones you have and put each of them on the TO for one fish. Will you do that ? If not, why not ?
Gerontious means value outside of the game Splotch, Well I think he does anyway lol :)
Gerontious means value outside of the game Splotch, Well I think he does anyway lol :)
I get that and I kind of agree in a way, but that's a given. You can't sell stuff but if it were allowed you could, that's all. There's no legitimate connection between the money in to the game and the money available to withdraw because you can't withdraw any... On that level I agree completely.
We place a value on what we own and not so much achieved as we're non-competitive but the game keeps going because of that value, things aren't completely worthless to us. I'm not interested in who got however many via whatever method as that's covered by the extensive bug collection, I'm just trying to say that things have value and it's not impossible to find it a bit annoying that some have more of one of the intended high-end item than others. Bear in mind I got an extra one, but from the start of the event - I'm not entirely clean myself although that was a genuine mistake.
Just seems to be a fairly decent amnesty considering we play for time, basically... And getting up to 5 instead of 1 of those is fair beasty, it's not worthless.
Look, it's human nature to try and gain advantage. Within the construct of our societies we have rules we follow (mostly) but will always try to gain advantage within these rules (most of us). Same as in the 'society' here, but this a game people, a GAME. Give back what you knowingly took outside the rules, there are other more subtle advantages to be had and gain advantage, ones that aren't so blatant. It really isn't going to hurt, not life threatening, not imprisonment bringing.
Gerontius:
What they are doing, and this is the argument I failed to see until a couple of pages back, is protecting the emotional wellbeing of the people who have invested money into this game.
Any argument about cheating/stealing etc is just wrong. It's not about punishing the cheaters, it's about making the gem-buyers feel better so they keep on spending.
Got to admit it would seem there is an element of truth there...
so at the end of the day will they ban the cheaters ? they cant force them to return the imp store house's it seems so what other choice is there ?
this is a fiasco tbh....just like the start/stop event itself :(
Personally I think this whole event smacked of alpha code, untested and untried. Many reported the errors on test and nothing was done. While I don't think exploiting the bugs is right, nor do I think BB has the right to be threatening and demanding the way they did.Very heavy handed for a slapshod run event that really was a horrible mistake to even start up on BB's end.
For me, apparently I am not a hacker or cheat, cause I didnt get more than 4...LMAO! I love that part the best, its awesome. Hey there little thief, your going to gaol...oh no wait up, you only stole 3 items, thats just fine, no problem there, nothing to see here run along.
Yea I dunno, on one hand BB is atrocious at communicating, and they really dont seem to understand basic human nature, or how to converse nicely with their customers. My gut feeling tells me they should let this one go, cop it on the chin. Looks like so many are in support of keeping their ill gotten goods (regardless of the morality of it), and there is only a minority that seems too upset about it, bleh let it go. Stop with ban threats. Perhaps u should spend more effort into listening to the testers on test server, or maybe even ..shock..test the stuff yourself before making it live. I mean aren't you even embarrassed at the horrifying code you let loose on your customers? I have a technology background myself, and i honestly can't imagine letting something so flaky out as a production version...lol. Let alone trying to ban people over the mess you caused.
My final message, perhaps asking for stuff back would have been ok, if you had admitted to this being a bug exploit, not a cheat or hack. That is inaccurate and is like comparing someone that took money from a faulty ATM machine, as apposed to a deliberate snatch and grab, or a bank holdup. Sure both are wrong, but the morality of either is quite a large gap. A smack on the wrist for one, and jail sentence for the other. But yea its a game, u made your money, people don't seem too upset at the stolen goods. There are more who spend money and got the extras, than there are who didnt and dont spend money and are complaining. Better business option is to support those who make you the most money :P
goodmorning .i am one of some they gave their storehouses back today not big deal 6 of them .i want to know what happens with the most are not given back .they got banned they took them from their islands or some of us just pay for the all exploiters?
ok so i got 6 (5 "illegally"!!) imp stores. Can BB say with any degree of certainty that I, or others, exploited this bug knowingly? No they can't, I may have clicked on the imp store at the end of the event, looked in mail/star menu for it, did not see it and decided to relog (as this needs to be done frequently on this game). after relog noticed storehouse is not greyed out so clicked again, check mail/star no joy, relog etc. My eyesight is really poor so may or may not have seen imp.stores in star menu.
BB send me a mail saying you are only allowed to "steal" 3 Imp.store, u must put the 5 imp.stores, you got by exploiting the poor code we implemented, in your star menu so we can take them back. I put 2 stores back in my star menu (to display "good faith" on my part) as this would mean I would now only have 3 "exploited" imp.stores on my island which according to BB is acceptable. After this mornings maintenance I get this mail:
As described in our mail from Friday, 18th of July, we tried to delete wrongfully acquired Improved Storehouses from your star menu. Unfortunately, the sufficient amount of 2 could not be deleted. As we want to avoid deleting Improved Storehouses from the island or banning your account, we ask you again to put the rest of the Improved Storehouses in your star menu.
You redeemed 6 Improved Storehouses and you may keep one of them. 2 were deleted. Please put the remaining amount of Improved Storehouses in the star menu until the next maintenance.
Your “The Settlers Online” Team
This begs the question: Why the heavy handed threats when BB can just delete the "exploited" items from your island?
As described in our mail from Friday, 18th of July, we tried to delete wrongfully acquired Improved Storehouses from your star menu. Unfortunately, the sufficient amount of 2 could not be deleted. As we want to avoid deleting Improved Storehouses from the island or banning your account, we ask you again to put the rest of the Improved Storehouses in your star menu.
You redeemed 6 Improved Storehouses and you may keep one of them. 2 were deleted. Please put the remaining amount of Improved Storehouses in the star menu until the next maintenance.
Your “The Settlers Online” Team
That message is pretty badly worded, if I were you I'd highlight what I have and ask them to explain in a way that makes sense. :confused:
This begs the question: Why the heavy handed threats when BB can just delete the "exploited" items from your island?
Deleting stuff out of a database is a two second process, doing it indiscriminately and without prior notice is a bit off. I think the "heavy handed threats" were more damage limitation than they were scare tactics.
Salem_Warrior_1
22.07.14, 07:53
simple BB are giving you the chance to do the right thing first before removing them off you island....... fair idd say.. so just put them in star and all will be ok
i have my answer (guarky) from you what bb doing to ppl not given their stores .
What they are doing, and this is the argument I failed to see until a couple of pages back, is protecting the emotional wellbeing of the people who have invested money into this game.
Any argument about cheating/stealing etc is just wrong. It's not about punishing the cheaters, it's about making the gem-buyers feel better so they keep on spending.
Got to admit it would seem there is an element of truth there...
Of course there's an element of truth there and it's a pointless point because it goes without saying.
When you're trying to make money out of something like this you focus your efforts on creating and maintaining as many active revenue streams as possible... You don't focus your efforts on destroying them, that would be stupid.
I bet if BB did some analysis of the players who managed to "exploit" this coding bug they would find that the majority of the exploits would be from players who actually spend a lot of time on the game, as apposed to just logging on to claim daily rewards during the event. Personally I would have thought people who spend more time on a game are more likely to spend money on that game. Just a thought, no evidence other than that from guild chat and global.
so those who got 1000 of improved storehouse by using exploit. and naybe they get away with it..but what happenes with those who didnt use exploit?...nice
I would like to point out that I was able to give back the ISHs, did so, and received a letter reminding me to "play fair" in the future. There was no need for an additional insult, and since we are not in competition with each other, it is ridiculous in any case to try to pretend the issue is one of fairness. I know those of you who are eager also to insult the people who saw no harm in seeing whether the error made by the programmers would be accepted as their own fault or visited upon the players will now insult me. Go ahead, I can't stop you, and though the moderators should, apparently they won't.
As posted in the original thread (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/28758-Multiple-Improved-Storehouses), all questions on this matter should be directed to support.
The script ran and a follow-up mail should have been sent to the players who received the original mail.
I have reported your feedback on this matter (and will continue to do so).
The request to not offend others when posting in the forum stands as always. (I understand some of you were upset, but let's try and follow that from now on or we will have no choice but to close the thread.)
Thank you!
Ravel- I did contact Support, and they directed me to the forum.
Foofygirl, I have reviewed your ticket and the questions you asked were referring to bans. My suggestion was for players having difficulties or being unclear on the messages received and/or the forum post.
Please follow the instructions received via in-game mail as they should explain everything. Support should also be able to clear out any questions you might have on following these directions.
Watching people kicking and screaming about having to give back this stuff and only getting four or five improved storehouses while saying fairness isn't an issue despite the fact other players only got one or two is one of the weirdest situations that I've witnessed so far this year on any of the forums that I visit.
Quick Edit : Looks like I misread it and you can't keep any extra, everyone is allowed two in total from the event... Seems fair. *ducks*
Mortallicus
22.07.14, 15:31
As I understand it those that got more than 3 'extra' storehouses had to give all of those they got (including the 3) back in their star. They dont get to keep the 3 that BB seemed to be saying they will allow to these people.
So if say someone got 6 extra they had to put 6 in their star. Just keeping the one legitimate one. This is their punishment :D
In the meantime those that managed to get up to 3 extra may keep them as long as they got no more.
This is why the 'kicking and screaming' in fairness. Most I think will take on the chin okay i got caught i should pay all back and walk quietly away including the up to 3 that BB are allowing and imo should not. Just say nicely ' please may I have my ball back ' and most would have just complied. No bad feelings. Simples.
Gandalf-rs
22.07.14, 16:08
Guys i have 4 storehouse 3 of them i seel and spend many for resures what now i back just one storehouse
As I understand it those that got more than 3 'extra' storehouses had to give all of those they got (including the 3) back in their star. They dont get to keep the 3 that BB seemed to be saying they will allow to these people.
So if say someone got 6 extra they had to put 6 in their star. Just keeping the one legitimate one. This is their punishment :D
In the meantime those that managed to get up to 3 extra may keep them as long as they got no more.
This is why the 'kicking and screaming' in fairness. Most I think will take on the chin okay i got caught i should pay all back and walk quietly away including the up to 3 that BB are allowing and imo should not. Just say nicely ' please may I have my ball back ' and most would have just complied. No bad feelings. Simples.
Ahhhh I see now, you're right! It's mental, I'm just going to give up. :p
Gandalf-rs
22.07.14, 16:18
if bb team wants to ban me because I can not rectify their mistake again I repeat I have four, but only one storehouse and then what if I'm not able to get the rest that I sold and spent the money and I'm willing to go back but how?Some say.If not i have 3000 gems for a gift for some if must stop this game
i got 1 from event...need more :))
i got 1 from event...need more :))
Same, Can I get 3 then please Ravel? Seeing as 3 is an acceptable amount, I wish to be treated as an equal.
Edit: I'm more than happy to pay 600 gems for: 500 beans, up to 150 footballs, a school and a storehouse.
Mannerheim
22.07.14, 17:39
if bb team wants to ban me because I can not rectify their mistake again I repeat I have four, but only one storehouse and then what if I'm not able to get the rest that I sold and spent the money and I'm willing to go back but how?Some say.If not i have 3000 gems for a gift for some if must stop this game
if you got the mail from bb then buy the stores back from trade or merchant if you have 3k gems
else game over
Atm you can buy imp storehouse from guild market..
so did anyone get a ban or was it just a idle threat?
so did anyone get a ban or was it just a idle threat?
Lol if they was banned they can't post here. It's what being banned means. If anyone else posts on their behalf it's at best unprovable hearsay, at worst evidence of another offence which could lead to a ban.
they got a warning think next 1 they are gone
so uncIear tho, thought if u had 3 from bug then u were in the cIear from first posts from BB if u had 4 or more then you have to pay them back but doesnt say how many u can keep? now saying different? they need to be more specific if u ask me {by the way i onIy got 1 SH from event} the communication is horrific on BB's part as per usuaI they need 2 rethink this...
I found it to be very clear, all explained here:
forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/28758-Multiple-Improved-Storehouses (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/28758-Multiple-Improved-Storehouses)
If you got 4 or more stores, you must return all but one.
FastSimTSOmaps
22.07.14, 22:12
Ok we have found how to detected the ilegal storehouse, image here
http://settlersonlinemaps.com/imgs/222.png (http://settlersonlinemaps.com)
haha thumbs up for the picture
sorry i read a post wrong so u can keep up 2 3 if u didnt get 4 or more if u got 4 or more then u have to pay back enought to Ieave u with 1 i get it now :D stiII wish i had 3 not 1 hehe
Sharpielein
22.07.14, 23:28
Uhm ... they actually put artwork on that? ? ?
If so, then ... sorry to say, but it doesn't look as much like a bug as it looks like a "Live test", because artwork don't come from nowhere, someone has to spend time for it.
Not only for the pictures, but there must be some coding which I -personally- consider more effort than changing the maximum of a slider from 25 to 500 (hint hint).
thats a good point sharpeiIein IoI :) conspiracy
did i miss something? bb gave out free stores? then want them back? but they let you keep a few? what about all of us who were honest and just got the one.. can we get 3 more from bb to level things up?
did i miss something? bb gave out free stores? then want them back? but they let you keep a few? what about all of us who were honest and just got the one.. can we get 3 more from bb to level things up?
LOL I said the same, Honesty and integrity just don't pay. The lesson we learn here is to abuse the system, If we get caught fine, but if not tyvm :) Nice life lessons you teach BB.
7yr oIds of the future beware u oId peopIe BB is making an army
Sharpielein
23.07.14, 04:41
"Fair" would be if everyone except the abusers got 2 free storehouses delivered by mail, and that's possible because they know who the abusers were.
All of a sudden, legitimate players and cheaters would be on equal footing again.
sharpielein:how do we know if you are not one of abusers too or some others who saying they were honest and dont use bug?i said i use the bug and gave back all stores .if you go back a year ago there was a big bug on line for a month with the gold refill in that time noone wrote anything about cheaters or abusers
FastSimTSOmaps
23.07.14, 05:30
Ok we have found how to detected the ilegal storehouse, image here
http://settlersonlinemaps.com/imgs/222.png (http://settlersonlinemaps.com)
Btw,this is a joke :)
did i miss something? bb gave out free stores? then want them back? but they let you keep a few? what about all of us who were honest and just got the one.. can we get 3 more from bb to level things up?LOL I said the same, Honesty and integrity just don't pay. The lesson we learn here is to abuse the system, If we get caught fine, but if not tyvm :) Nice life lessons you teach BB.
After sobering up a bit and going over it in my head yet again I think the maximum is 4.
You could have obtained 1 storehouse at the very start of the event by clicking the final reward and based on the wording of the News item you could have obtained and kept up to 3 from the final day of the event. So players could have 1, 2, 3 or 4 "legitimately". Anything over that pushed them in to slap on the wrist territory and penalised players could legitimately have 1 or 2 because they could have grabbed 1 from the start of the event...
If a player got 1 because they encountered no bugs then they will have less than a player that grabbed that 1 from the start and 100 from the end of the event but had to give back all but 1 of that 100 leaving them with 2. That's a bit poop. :rolleyes:
NB: I bugged out at the start and got 1 but had no bugs at the end giving me another 1, I have 2.
Sharpielein
23.07.14, 08:38
Btw,this is a joke :)
Haha and I fell for it :D
Sharpielein
23.07.14, 08:41
sharpielein:how do we know if you are not one of abusers too or some others who saying they were honest and dont use bug?i said i use the bug and gave back all stores .if you go back a year ago there was a big bug on line for a month with the gold refill in that time noone wrote anything about cheaters or abusers
Why would it matter?
My point was that if the cheaters get to keep their spoils, then the legitimate players are the losers.
If the legitimate players get something and cheaters lose out, that's fair.
Haha and I fell for it :D
I wish it was an optional skin, I prefer the piratey look.
wolf_man95
23.07.14, 11:43
I think this whole thing was a absolute Mess, but i can see points for all the arguments raised from both sides i really can.
But
I think i would been very annoyed if my pegi-7 son or daughter came and played this game to be threatened by the developers, for something that to them would be no more moraly wrong then getting a biscuit from the biscuit barrel without mommy or daddys say so, this i think has been a monumental error on behalf of BB_. BB i think its time you maybe re-assed your pegi-7 rating if you want to threaten 7 year olds with the lose of there accounts, these children don't understand fraud and i can assure you they would not of view it as theft.
I'm sorry BB_ i like you and i like that game but on this occasion the "Threat" was wrong you should of just left them of removed them.
i m with wolf...they kinda scared people here... even the big ones :))
dodos_manus
23.07.14, 15:18
http://i.imgur.com/G7Trr6c.jpg
Sharpielein
23.07.14, 15:38
BB i think its time you maybe re-assed your pegi-7 rating if you want to threaten 7 year olds with the lose of there accounts, these children don't understand fraud and i can assure you they would not of view it as theft.
They shouldn't really be playing a game if they can't understand the rules, even if the age permits them to play it.
Especially not if their parents refuse to take accountability for what they do online.
Actually, just as in Real Life: If your 7-year-old-child gets $100000 for going over start in Monopoly, that will also result in nobody wanting to play with him anymore.
This is just the virtual version of the very thing which is very, very normal in reality, so what is wrong with that?
Plus, Bluebyte is not "threatening people with the loss of their account"
Bluebyte is merely saying "You got something you shouldn't have, and you MUST give it back!"
What would you say if in Real Life, your 7-year-old child came home with the teacher's wallet?
Would you explain to the school that they can't impose consequences because a 7yo can't understand the concept of theft, or would you explain to your child that they did do something wrong and must give it back? Would you consider it draconic if the school threatened consequences if the teacher didn't get his wallet back unscathed?
Yes, mistakes can happen, but a very polite warning "You crossed the line, now undo it" is NOT an immoral "threat".
I know certain other gaming companies where you'd simply end up with a no-warning permban. That may be better in the sense that you wouldn't be able to call it a "threat".
But would you like it better?
They shouldn't really be playing a game if they can't understand the rules, even if the age permits them to play it.
Especially not if their parents refuse to take accountability for what they do online.
Actually, just as in Real Life: If your 7-year-old-child gets $100000 for going over start in Monopoly, that will also result in nobody wanting to play with him anymore.
This is just the virtual version of the very thing which is very, very normal in reality, so what is wrong with that?
Plus, Bluebyte is not "threatening people with the loss of their account"
Bluebyte is merely saying "You got something you shouldn't have, and you MUST give it back!"
What would you say if in Real Life, your 7-year-old child came home with the teacher's wallet?
Would you explain to the school that they can't impose consequences because a 7yo can't understand the concept of theft, or would you explain to your child that they did do something wrong and must give it back? Would you consider it draconic if the school threatened consequences if the teacher didn't get his wallet back unscathed?
Yes, mistakes can happen, but a very polite warning "You crossed the line, now undo it" is NOT an immoral "threat".
I know certain other gaming companies where you'd simply end up with a no-warning permban. That may be better in the sense that you wouldn't be able to call it a "threat".
But would you like it better?
And what is your suggestion? To ban the players of the mistake of the company? If the Bluebyte does that from my side i dont spent a single euro on this game again. And i believe and other players nave the same opinion with me
The existence of the glitch was BlueByte's fault. But the people abusing the glitch are responsible for their own action. Just because there is a glitch doesn't mean you have to abuse it.
padster007
23.07.14, 16:44
yeah id even pay a percentage for an extra 2 storehouses, say 75% of what one is worth? ill barter for extra, unlike those pesky exploiters who are like children caught with there hands in the cookie jar. :P
The existence of the glitch was BlueByte's fault. But the people abusing the glitch are responsible for their own action. Just because there is a glitch doesn't mean you have to abuse it.
And because of this action of the players the company must ban them?
Look i understand the game has rules who must obey from the players and if they violates them the company must take action against them.
But in the summer event the company give this event unfinished and untested to the players with the known side effects.
And i believe the Bluebyte must find an other legitimate way for the player who make use of the bug.
I do not think it was inappropriate of BB to ask that the extra ISH be returned, even though it was their mistake and even though their request was very belated, and I have in fact returned mine. But if for a mistake that was theirs and compounded by their slow response, they present players who at least thought their action had been condoned by BB and therefore sold ISH, which now cannot be bought from TO (there aren't enough for sale) so must be bought from the merchant and therefore ultimately with real money, the company threatens to ban players, they leave these players with the option of being banned, spending real money under that menace, or simply quitting the game, to which they had contributed and from which they had derived enjoyment. I can understand you people wanting to have the same goodies as other players. I cannot understand your eagerness to have them injured in a serious way. Granted, a few of you can sell storehouses for exorbitant prices to some of the exploiters, thereby exploiting the exploit at least as much as the offenders. But most storehouses would have to be purchased from the merchant, for gems, which in no way profits other players. I would strongly suggest that it is in BB's interest to find a better way. For instance, BB gives each of us 100 gems a week. They could withhold those until either store houses or their gem value had been returned. If penalties are being handed out, as opposed to resources simply being repossessed, however, BB should penalize itself, perhaps by giving two extra ISH to all players who participated in the game, not just the ones they have decided to declare innocent.
Because of bugs that were identified on the test server but not adequately dealt with, and other aspects of poor implementation, the football event was intrinsically unfair to a number of players
That being so, I find it particularly bizarre that BB chose to penalize players for lack of fair play when the players' actions, however undesirable from BB's point of view, did not in fact disadvantage other players. No one was forced to buy an Improved Storage House in TO, and one player's quantity of storage is not a factor in another player's success or failure in the game.
The only party to the game who can be unfair to players is, in fact, BB. It can and often does arrange matters so that they favour gem buyers; players believe, perhaps erroneously, that some servers are compensated for service failures more generously than others. However that may be, even BB cannot by providing goods to one player and not to another enable the first player to "defeat" the second, because there is no pvp, no individual ranking system, no in-game reward of any kind that is unavailable to one player because it was given to another.
i wonder what was the most improved storehouses any one player received from BB's mistake?
bottom line...
BB says those that got 4 can keep them
those that got 25 can only keep 1
seems fair.....
smh
There is a basic question that continues to go unanswered... In taking the storehouses, what rule was broken?
Even with today's revisions to the In-Game Rules and Code of Conduct, using an exploit is not forbidden, and BB has not accused us of breaking any rules.
However, with its official communications, BB insinuated that we are cheaters by asking us to refer questions to "Report suspected Hacking and Cheating", or thieves with "wrongfully acquired" storehouses. This opened the door for insults, accusations and flaming by some people in this thread... actions which ARE in direct violation of the IGR/CoC, and sadly have continued past Ravel's reminder yesterday.
There was a conversation (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/28610-how-to-spot-a-scam-trade)recently regarding what does or does not constitute a trade scam. (staff response on page 2 of thread) If I buy a trade which hurts me in TO, it's my mistake, not the person's who placed the trade. If I place a bad trade in TO and someone buys it before I can withdraw it, they are not scamming me; I made the mistake. If I contact that person explaining my mistake, apologizing and asking for it back nicely, there is a high chance they will agree to reverse the trade. If I contact them with anger and name-calling and threats, there is a high chance that they will snort and say NO.
BB made a bad trade. If they had posted right away with something like "Hey guys, there was another bug in the calendar which allowed some ppl to take more than the 1 storehouse we intended. We have fixed the problem and will be devising a way to reclaim the extra storehouses, details to follow. Please direct questions to Support--Problems with the Game" they would have met a much different response and had a higher success rate. Instead they waited nearly a week and then came with aggression and threats, and many people snorted and said NO.
BB made a bad trade. They put up some bad code and lost some resources at a below market price. In the absence of a rule violation or the invocation of the "you're banned because we say you are" clauses, perhaps like the player with the bad trade, they need to take it on the chin and move on.
please BB close this threat...and send us some Improved silos instead :)))
dodos_manus
23.07.14, 21:59
Colophon
From the beginning my intention was to point out that the main issue is not the return of resources but that the company is accusing all the players who earned from this event, by what is clearly a company's mistake, as hackers and cheaters. This is a game. When you are accusing a player that is a cheater then the game has no meaning any more, because once a cheater always a cheater.
As players we have accepted the following term:
16.2 Termination of the Account or Services at UBISOFT's initiative
In the event of a breach of your legal or contractual obligations, we reserve the right to take legal action on grounds of civil or criminal responsibility in order to stop the breach and obtain compensation for our losses. In particular, and without limitation, we reserve the right to prosecute any User who was deliberately damaged or attempted to damage the Services or disrupted the legitimate functioning of the Services or provided assistance for so doing.
In our case if a player accepts to return the resources, is as if he declares himself guilty of deliberately cheating and is accepting this penalty in order to avoid further prosecution from the company. More over, who can reassure me that they will not take any further legal actions for prosecuting any user? Today we face this situation, in future who knows? As you realize this is not a simple and innocent game.
Best regards to all who posted in this thread.
Sharpielein
24.07.14, 00:24
The existence of the glitch was BlueByte's fault. But the people abusing the glitch are responsible for their own action. Just because there is a glitch doesn't mean you have to abuse it.
+1
+1
what does that mean?
The company has only the right to defend themselves and the players not?
From the moment i spent real money to the game i demand to respect me.
And is very suspicious the way various posters defend the actions of the company
And i ask again the bluebyte has the right to prosecute players who breach the rules of the game BUT who protect the players from the wrongfully accuses of the company?
There is a basic question that continues to go unanswered... In taking the storehouses, what rule was broken?
Even with today's revisions to the In-Game Rules and Code of Conduct, using an exploit is not forbidden, and BB has not accused us of breaking any rules.
However, with its official communications, BB insinuated that we are cheaters by asking us to refer questions to "Report suspected Hacking and Cheating", or thieves with "wrongfully acquired" storehouses. This opened the door for insults, accusations and flaming by some people in this thread... actions which ARE in direct violation of the IGR/CoC, and sadly have continued past Ravel's reminder yesterday.
There was a conversation (http://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/28610-how-to-spot-a-scam-trade)recently regarding what does or does not constitute a trade scam. (staff response on page 2 of thread) If I buy a trade which hurts me in TO, it's my mistake, not the person's who placed the trade. If I place a bad trade in TO and someone buys it before I can withdraw it, they are not scamming me; I made the mistake. If I contact that person explaining my mistake, apologizing and asking for it back nicely, there is a high chance they will agree to reverse the trade. If I contact them with anger and name-calling and threats, there is a high chance that they will snort and say NO.
BB made a bad trade. If they had posted right away with something like "Hey guys, there was another bug in the calendar which allowed some ppl to take more than the 1 storehouse we intended. We have fixed the problem and will be devising a way to reclaim the extra storehouses, details to follow. Please direct questions to Support--Problems with the Game" they would have met a much different response and had a higher success rate. Instead they waited nearly a week and then came with aggression and threats, and many people snorted and said NO.
BB made a bad trade. They put up some bad code and lost some resources at a below market price. In the absence of a rule violation or the invocation of the "you're banned because we say you are" clauses, perhaps like the player with the bad trade, they need to take it on the chin and move on.
i agree with you
Salem_Warrior_1
24.07.14, 06:11
Ive played over two years and seen many a glitch, good and bad.....BB has rewarded us when there glitches has cost us resorces.time ect, even when there server got struck by lightning, that wasnt thier fault, they rewarded us for lost play time ect..so they have been fair with us
now they ask the same back from us. i see it as a two way street
1 or 2 extra storehouses ok, but some players i know got 14 plus, this is a big game advantage over normal play, so fairs fair, give um back and move on
There are a couple of people still saying the extra storehouses don't matter so I'm going to sum up as quickly as possible what I've been saying in relation to that :
Storehouse Value = 15,000gc
4x Storehouse Value = 60,000gc
60,000gc = 120 lvl3>lvl4 upgrades on basic structures.
After 24 hours your map is 120 levels stronger and buff efficiency on all of those structures has been increased.
The storehouses that are placed have no effect other than a potential increase in the stack size per lot on the TO.
You don't have to be a genius to figure out how an influx of a high end tradeable item has a massive knock-on effect. Please stop saying that obtaining extra storehouses isn't an issue because they are worthless and don't make any difference, it's nonsense... They do.
One thing I do find worrying and that's the changes to the game rules and code of conduct. I can find no notification that those have changed.
Unless somebody is able to show me where such notification is. Then I would ask by what moral, ethical and legal standards, how these changes can be considered to be a binding contract between two party's.
My initial research on the subject for how current English and EU legislation view these changes says BB needs our agreement to the changes for them to be valid. Please show me where the tick box is so that I can agree to the changes.
My initial research on the subject for how current English and EU legislation view these changes says BB needs our agreement to the changes for them to be valid. Please show me where the tick box is so that I can agree to the changes.
When I've taken the time to read a TOS, which granted is very rare, there's usually a condition in there that states that the terms of service agreement may be subject to change without prior notice. That said, when my PS4 TOS changes I do have to confirm that I accept the revisions so I guess Sony are trying to cover their back over something, you're probably right and a conditional clause stating what you signed up to can change at any time isn't enough or at least not enough to cover every country... That does make perfect sense really as a change in terms without agreement could potentially leave you retrospectively liable for something, I guess.
Mannerheim
24.07.14, 09:34
bottom line...
BB says those that got 4 can keep them
those that got 25 can only keep 1
seems fair.....
smh
already been said that it was not obvious that were the 4 or less storehouse mistakes or exploiting (one normal click, 1 extra click at start, 2 clicks at end) more than 4 total is something that was not normal according to statistics and was considered exploiting. There is no point to cause more problem than needed.
wolf_man95
24.07.14, 11:53
My point stands my boy wouldn't come home with someone's wallet cos that direct version of stealing has been catered for in his up bringing he has been told it is wrong, but I'm afraid that this eventuality hasn't been catered for, an no sharplelein ur wrong and this is why self technological exploration is important for a childs development, with parental locks in-place to censor out the things u don't want them to see, this game will pass through a parental lock because of its pegi rating so my son can access it, an as an adult who am i to challenge a game that a parental lock has allowed him access to, weather i know he understands the rules or not.
On the same token if he dropped some chewing gum wrapper out of his pocket and the man walking beside us processed to have a pop at my son about the fact he had just littered while he was 7 years old I'm afraid i wouldn't take too kindly to that person an maybe sternly request he takes up his complaint with me, as its my responsibility to make sure my son has the correct morals instilled into him and not "joe bloggs"
we all understand how to use Microsoft but has anyone read the full terms and conditions of use for windows? and if so do u understands them? how is a 7 year old going to understand it ?
sorry point still stands i don't disagree with BB about the imp's but i do disagree with this method, the answer is simple remove or leave, without this return them of u will get a perma ban rubbish
already been said that it was not obvious that were the 4 or less storehouse mistakes or exploiting (one normal click, 1 extra click at start, 2 clicks at end) more than 4 total is something that was not normal according to statistics and was considered exploiting. There is no point to cause more problem than needed.
Or in other words: Expoiting bugs is beneficial to the player and allowed if done in moderation?
Isn't that your responsibility to teach him as a parent? Sorry going to be harsh here. This is the digital/online age. The fact that parents do not feel the need to discipline or teach their kids about what happens online is the fact you still don't think digital. This is how cyberbullies are allowed to exist. Kids go online trahstalk, cheat, exploit and parents just go "oh well it's just a game or online so it doesn't have any real consequenses". Sorry but it has. Do you do find it necessary for others to tell you that you are responsible for a dropped gumwrapper ... but even though a ToS CLEARLY states it is your responsibility to make sure the kid doesn't cross the line, suddenly the company just needs to be quiet? Because you didn't bother to tell your kid exploiting a glitch could make him lose his account? Or do you also not teach your kid not to cheat in games like monopoly or chess? Yep SAME thing. People seriously need to start being responsible online as much as offline. Too many times it's brushed off as if it is without consequences or should be but well it's not. Time for you to realize that and start teaching your kids online actions can have as much consequenses as offline actions. Welcome to the digital age.
Isn't that your responsibility to teach him as a parent? Sorry going to be harsh here. This is the digital/online age. The fact that parents do not feel the need to discipline or teach their kids about what happens online is the fact you still don't think digital. This is how cyberbullies are allowed to exist. Kids go online trahstalk, cheat, exploit and parents just go "oh well it's just a game or online so it doesn't have any real consequenses". Sorry but it has. Do you do find it necessary for others to tell you that you are responsible for a dropped gumwrapper ... but even though a ToS CLEARLY states it is your responsibility to make sure the kid doesn't cross the line, suddenly the company just needs to be quiet? Because you didn't bother to tell your kid exploiting a glitch could make him lose his account? Or do you also not teach your kid not to cheat in games like monopoly or chess? Yep SAME thing. People seriously need to start being responsible online as much as offline. Too many times it's brushed off as if it is without consequences or should be but well it's not. Time for you to realize that and start teaching your kids online actions can have as much consequenses as offline actions. Welcome to the digital age.
I ask you again. Only the players must be responsible to the company?
The company's responsibility was to fix the glitch as soon as it was discovered. Now it is possible that the glitch was already appearant during testing and in that case they had the responsibility to fix it before that. However if it wasn't then they did what they had to. Aka fix the glitch as soon as they could. This includes time to make the patch, time before it was reported/discovered, etc etc. Did they do the second yes. So that responsibility they had they covered quite neatly I'd say. However if they already knew about the glitch and still released it, they should apologize for that. Should they allow you to keep the stuff you got because of the glitch? No way in heck. You continuously clicking and relogging: your responsibility and the consequenses of that are for you. Not to mention the fact they let people keep UP TO THREE for free as a way of saying: yeah our bad there was a glitch, so those three we consider an accident and our fault. Sooooo yeah they have been rather generous I'd say.
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