Reasoning and actual players. [Archive]

Gorefield

06.10.17, 22:05

Most of TSO players are closer to 40 than 30 and our ruleset is like we are all 6 year old girls. I am suggesting that WE get rid of all PEGI ratings and behave as the actual players are. We are playing TSO because we played Settlers early 90s and are fans of Settlers universe.

RinceWinde

07.10.17, 09:40

Hear Hear.
The game can be Pegi7 for all i care but the chat does not have to be. It's belittling and kills all good conversations and discussions. Like any 7 year old is protected from grownup talking amongst each other. As i said often, those rules are ridiculous.

Larili

07.10.17, 10:24

How often do we see in chat so called adults acting like children and push the language and tone to a level where the MODs and/or GM's have to put them on the naughty step? I fear there are too many `adult' players who would abuse any relaxing of the rules for their own agenda. The game gives you whisper and guild chat, so adults that want to have a more real age conversation can do so, without dragging the whole community into it and perhaps offending some or making others feel uncomfortable.
Its a game, a piece of escapism, and a place not to have to deal with RL issues for a few minutes, I can live with PEGI7 for those few minutes.

Kit_

07.10.17, 11:11

Dorotheus

07.10.17, 11:21

It does not matter that most of the player's are above a certain age the chat rules exist because there can be children present. A badly flawed system PEGI might be but no right minded adult would consider allowing the sort of adult talk you are asking for in front of kids.

Mannerheim

07.10.17, 12:21

Bluebyte and settlers do not set the pegi7 rules, that is decided by PEGI itself, and BB must abide by those rules.
Not to mention that although the majority of players may be adults, there are children who play.

But they specifically chose the EU servers to be pegi 7 and a kid friendly zone for some reason while some other regions are not. On those other servers for example people can freely talk about different topics, share youtube or other links and generally chat freely without having to watch out every word they use. Could have been rated pegi 12 or 16 as the <12 age group is usually the smallest and least profitable or "valuable" group of all players.

Kit_

07.10.17, 12:36

But they specifically chose the EU servers to be pegi 7 and a kid friendly zone for some reason while some other regions are not. On those other servers for example people can freely talk about different topics, share youtube or other links and generally chat freely without having to watch out every word they use. Could have been rated pegi 12 or 16 as the <12 age group is usually the smallest and least profitable or "valuable" group of all players.

PEGI only applies to europe, so only those servers that come under its jurisdiction.
America for example has other laws set by that country, afaik any game with chat must be for age13+

vigabrand

07.10.17, 13:01

idm pegi7, i do have reservations about an english chat room being moderated by volunteers who's native language is not english. It would be good if they could work out a more tolerant system. I have got on the wrong side of mods more than once for a misunderstanding. what english ppl know is humour can easily be mistaken by other europeans as something else. innocent english expressions can also have the same result. i once got into bother for NOT recruiting in g1.

However, after spending (too) many hours in chat rooms on other games and suffering what can only be described as disgusting behaviour, I welcome the mods and pegi7

Quick note to mods: please don't misunderstand my comments. I think you all do a great job and giving up your own time to do it on a regular basis is amazing :)

Mannerheim

07.10.17, 14:01

PEGI only applies to europe, so only those servers that come under its jurisdiction.
America for example has other laws set by that country, afaik any game with chat must be for age13+

Yep but the system is not one sided as the publisher is the one that applies for the rating and provides the required info for the evaluation. IIRC, French and Polish servers for example are not bound to PEGI 7 in the chat or at least had less restrictions.

SSSecretSquirrel

07.10.17, 14:50

as a 12yo girl i fully support upgrading to pegi12 :)

sparkz

07.10.17, 16:58

French and Polish servers for example are not bound to PEGI 7 in the chat or at least had less restrictions.

Cant speak for french, but polish has severe restrictions and endless complaints about moderators keeping the chat tidy kindergarten style.

Norton_C

07.10.17, 17:51

idm pegi7, i do have reservations about an english chat room being moderated by volunteers who's native language is not english. I have got on the wrong side of mods more than once for a misunderstanding. what english ppl know is humour can easily be mistaken by other europeans as something else. innocent english expressions can also have the same result. i once got into bother for NOT recruiting in g1.

However, after spending (too) many hours in chat rooms on other games and suffering what can only be described as disgusting behaviour, I welcome the mods and pegi7

Very true that thing about native (or at least Proficiency level) language. Every job requires certain level of skills. If somebody is not good at English, they are not qualified for this sort of "editing" job.

Mannerheim

07.10.17, 19:45

Cant speak for french, but polish has severe restrictions and endless complaints about moderators keeping the chat tidy kindergarten style.

Are all links allowed or have the rules changed in general? long time ago, back when the Polish servers were also the first ones to act as guinea pigs for patches I and few others used to visit there to get first hand info about patch changes and trade trends related to them and chat seemed to a lot more relaxed vs ours.

Gorefield

07.10.17, 20:34

PEGI is just bureaucratic system.

vigabrand

08.10.17, 07:17

hi Norton, dont get me wrong, all of the mods english is excellent, but they do misunderstand things sometimes, e.g. "dont get me wrong" and they dont always understand english humour, the same as i definitely do not understand european humour.

After reading Squirrels comment I am further reminded that we have young players here and I think having the rooms moderated "kindergarten" style is a price worth paying to prevent the chat rooms becoming horrible places for our children to visit. we still have whisper and guild for earthier subjects.

Quick note to mods: please don't misunderstand my comments. I think you all do a great job and giving up your own time to do it on a regular basis is amazing :)

vigabrand

08.10.17, 07:29

PEGI is just bureaucratic system.

i don't agree. this is from memory not google so please forgive any mistakes and lack of dates...

i think in the late 90's when games started to become more realistic and violent plus lots of gore g'ments decided it was time to start rating games as they do with films. the industry was very much against this and said they could moderate it themselves. g'ments surprisingly stepped back and allowed this to happen. now we have pegi designed by the games industry itself and not some stuffy bureaucrats who know nothing about games or the ppl who play them.

NicciNZ

10.10.17, 02:53

early on my kids did play and to be frank if not for the moderators and pegi rules my kids would of missed out on the interaction with others, they spent ages chatting with others many of simerla ages to themselves and i was thankful i could do things around house like cooking dinner without the need to ensure convo was suitable to there ages as the mods saw to it the the pegi7 was kept to. As others have said guild and whisper arent pegi7, so keep the global channels friendly for all you've other spaces for less child friendly conversations.

Tierarzt

10.10.17, 10:16

There are plenty of other games that are also rated PEGI 7 that do not have moderated chat, but the chat channels are very toxic. Do you really want that here as well?

BB_Saqui

10.10.17, 13:50

SmurfAsH

10.10.17, 17:40

While I understand your assumption, I can tell you that we have quite an active young audience; many who play with their parents and siblings. We believe at the core concept that The Settlers Online should be a family-friendly game, and so we stand by the PEGI-7 guidelines & rules. We have no intention of changing this.

Due to this, our public channels will continue to be moderated with this in mind e.g. global, trade and the forums. If you would like to have more adult-oriented discussions, please do so within the confines of a private channel such as your guild chat (but make sure you adhere to your guild rules) or PMs.
Well, the english profanity filter is active in guild chat as well, so..
No, it's not just keep "more adult-oriented discussions" there.
Actually, the issue is bigger than that.
In non-english guilds you'll get censored just because a harmless native word spells like an english non-pegi7 word.

Mannerheim

10.10.17, 19:09

Well, the english profanity filter is active in guild chat as well, so..
No, it's not just keep "more adult-oriented discussions" there.
Actually, the issue is bigger than that.
In non-english guilds you'll get censored just because a harmless native word spells like an english non-pegi7 word.

Yeah. For example we cant use a very common word "but" in our native language as in "weather is nice but could be warmer" as it gets filtered.

Dorotheus

10.10.17, 19:55

It's also a problem in English as well as words which are acceptable but contain a banned word are also filtered.

Iolanthe

10.10.17, 20:47

Mostly just tossing in my vote for "Actual children do exist in this game", and the majority of cringe-making behaviour seems to come from people old enough to know better.

Most of TSO players are closer to 40 than 30 and our ruleset is like we are all 6 year old girls. I am suggesting that WE get rid of all PEGI ratings and behave as the actual players are. We are playing TSO because we played Settlers early 90s and are fans of Settlers universe.

When a forum conversation about a well known and long standing game difficulty Collectibles hiding (in rocks etc) (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/25799-Collectibles-hiding-(in-rocks-etc)) can devolve fairly rapidly into trolling an entire generation: Magnificen Residence covering colectables in fron of them ~ Post #9 (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/34930-Magnificen-Residence-covering-colectables-in-fron-of-them?p=336175&viewfull=1#post336175) it's a safe bet the average age and sex of TSO players doesn't automatically mean we're all always thoughtful, considerate, and well behaved.

It's also a problem in English as well as words which are acceptable but contain a banned word are also filtered.

How do you mean?

https://image.prntscr.com/image/LWPiDYXtQt6nsdQMAPD-mg.png

That the Dutch "how" is filtered on a Euro server (also a very common typo in English for the same word) has always driven me bats but at least we've regained "Scooby", "billboard", and the letter "k".

SmurfAsH

10.10.17, 21:54

Mostly just tossing in my vote for "Actual children do exist in this game", and the majority of cringe-making behaviour seems to come from people old enough to know better.

When a forum conversation about a well known and long standing game difficulty Collectibles hiding (in rocks etc) (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/25799-Collectibles-hiding-(in-rocks-etc)) can devolve fairly rapidly into trolling an entire generation: Magnificen Residence covering colectables in fron of them ~ Post #10 (https://forum.thesettlersonline.com/threads/34930-Magnificen-Residence-covering-colectables-in-fron-of-them?p=336175&viewfull=1#post336175) it's a safe bet the average age and sex of TSO players doesn't automatically mean we're all always thoughtful, considerate, and well behaved.
I don't know how but it feels like the child in me just got seriously offended.. :confused::mad::p

SSSecretSquirrel

10.10.17, 22:32

Well, the english profanity filter is active in guild chat as well, so..
In non-english guilds you'll get censored just because a harmless native word spells like an english non-pegi7 word.

yes this is a problem.

Kriegor

10.10.17, 23:39

I support the pegi7, i been on many games that do not have filtering. Its fun for a few and avoided by many.

Iolanthe

11.10.17, 00:29

I don't know how but it feels like the child in me just got seriously offended.. :confused::mad:

Hey SmurfAsh, I'm not sure how my numbers went awry there, I meant to refer to Tierarzt's randomly whingey post:

They were originally labelled as "Hidden Collectibles". The idea was you had to search for them but Generation X expects everything handed to them on a silver plate.

I'll edit my earlier to reference post #9. Still, it doesn't matter really which generation, or sex, or nationality, or belief system is being thrown under the bus (and in my time here I've seen pretty much every example of "Anyone who isn't sufficiently me-like is the source of All The World's Problems" and assorted other bouts of nit-wittery, including a player, well past Gen X and/or Millenial age, who has grown so sulky about how the players here are too hard to upset so that same player (as announced frequently in Help) is off to FaceBook where it it's easier to upset people.)

I've had my run-ins with "moderation" here, and sometimes it does go overboard or gets confused but when [in yellow] manage to keep their own personal biases under control they do contribute a lot to maintaining a much less eyeball-bleeding level of toxicity than the standard "norm" that is much of the interwebz. It's not perfect, it needs work, every human can do better, but TSO chat is ever so much less nauseating that your average YouTube video comments section.

vigabrand

12.10.17, 09:35

I've had my run-ins with "moderation" here, and sometimes it does go overboard or gets confused but when [in yellow] manage to keep their own personal biases under control they do contribute a lot to maintaining a much less eyeball-bleeding level of toxicity than the standard "norm" that is much of the interwebz. It's not perfect, it needs work, every human can do better, but TSO chat is ever so much less nauseating that your average YouTube video comments section.

I could have written that myself. well put Iolanthe :)