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20,000 gems for an endless copper mine?!
That's £75 of real money. £75!
Insane.
Seriously... someone with some perspective at BB take a step back and look at about £75 or 100 Euros of REAL money as a value for a copper mine, no matter that it's 'endless'.
I wouldn't pay £75 for a game, never mind a small element of a game.
You are off your heads.
Great game mind. :)
117.0300 US dollars
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobLurker
I can't help but agree, this is so far beyond the borderline of insanity that I'm considering investing in shares of strait jacket manufacturers.
All of the trader items added over the last couple of months have been grossly overpriced relative to both the real and the original items on offer. I'd go as far to say that everything is priced about 5x what it should be to encourage consistent and fair micro transactions.
...and then there's the interesting use of the word 'endless'. If it were truly endless, then it wouldn't amortise after 600 days at level 1 (or 120 days at level 5?). A recycling plant is endless and a watermill is endless and neither are subject to amortisation. They're also significantly cheaper.
should be the same price as a recycling plant, copper ore and coal have settled at similar trading prices so they both have about the same value to players.
Excellent point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kotugo
'Endless' coal plant is 990 gems, yet 'endless' copper is 20,000?! It simply makes no sense at all. These are similarly valued resources for players, but BB is altering their value by a factor of more than 20. Copper is NOT more than 20 times as valuable as coal.
Someone at BB has gone completely gem-crazy. I like this game, I've even spent money on it, but this is ludicrous. The gem pit looks an OK investment for someone planning to play for a very long time (a year to get double the gems), it's basically a £75 subscription for a year, but the copper mine price is crazy. I do hope this isn't a sign of things to come, because BB won't see another penny off me if it is. I'll keep playing, but there's no way I'm spending that kind of money for so little return in the game.
You don't have to buy them
Who is responsible for deciding on these prices? It would be nice to know if its someone at Bluebyte or Ubisoft, or maybe even the name of the actually person deciding it.
That's not the argument and is frankly a tired non-sequitur that people seem to enjoy throwing into discussion where they have no valid point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
The suggestion is that, for people who do spend money on gems, the price of the Endless Copper Mine is hugely unbalanced relative to the cost of other infinite supply items. The fact this seems to be following a theme of recent high-priced items is only going to serve to put people off the game rather than encourage sales.
£450 for 6 endless copper mines..... bargain.
Tierarzt makes a lot of dumb comments like that... I think his just a youngster tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by RawrUK
Speaking as one who has spent a few pounds each month on this game, and is "prepared" to spend more, if the value is there.. I see the endless copper and the endless gems purchase price being the stop mark .. I shall not be spending any more after this month, if the value of these "add-ons" does not come into line with other "endless" purchases, such as the recycle plant, and the endless water mill.
Nope. Gem it's not endless... It caontains 40.000 gems to mine ;-) It's writen it's pays back in 6 months, so it means that you get 40.000 gems after the year. That's insane... LoL...
I thought as well that copper will cost maximum 2000 if recycling plant costs 990...
Have to agree, this is all getting a bit out of my league of what I'm willing to spend on a game. I will consider the gem pit, £75 for 40k gems is not bad and I think I can get a year out of this game.
The point is, You don't need to buy one. They are a premium feature at a premium priceQuote:
Originally Posted by RawrUK
I have full confidence that how Tierarzt meant it is not what I am agreeing with but in this case I do think what he said is perhaps our best option.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
Talking about how insane the copper mine price is will only get us so far. What we simply need to do is just not buy it. It’s the only real say we will ever get in this game. Money talks as the old saying goes and if BB doesn’t get our money they will hopefully be forced to rethink the pricing structure.
The fact it only lasts for 600 days only makes things worse.
Indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopey
However, not saying anything about it achieves nothing. Voicing an opinion here is one way to gauge the feeling of other players and to communicate the fact that one is not happy with the situation. (There are other ways too.) Naturally enough I will not be buying an 'endless' copper mine at the current insane price, and by discussing it here I, and others, make it clear that BB will not be receiving money from us that they might otherwise have received.
It's a forum, it's for discussing things. :)
Hi guys,
I feel I must intervene here...
When we say endless, we mean endless. The mines do not deplete after a certain amount or number of days. They will carry on indefinitely.
I really don't know where you guys got this idea that the mines would stop working after a certain amount of days x)
Best,
BB_Azariel
Edited my post :)Quote:
Originally Posted by BobLurker
http://i45.tinypic.com/303ddet.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by BB_Azariel
amortize, amortise [əˈmɔːtaɪz]
vb (tr)
1. (Economics, Accounting & Finance / Banking & Finance) Finance to liquidate (a debt, mortgage, etc.) by instalment payments or by periodic transfers to a sinking fund
2. (Economics, Accounting & Finance / Accounting & Book-keeping) to write off (a wasting asset) by annual transfers to a sinking fund
3. (Law) Property law (formerly) to transfer (lands, etc.) in mortmain
[from Medieval Latin admortizāre, from Old French amortir to reduce to the point of death, ultimately from Latin ad to + mors death]
For me this is what makes me think it is not endless.
I agree that endless copper mine is way overpriced !!! but as this resource constantly runs out because there are only a few deposits across the island they got u over a barrel.... also the fact u need so much to replace recruits ( bronzeswords) i can understand it being more pricey than say a coal plant because once u have 200 odd soldiers steel can be put on hold ,and so wont use as much ..but more around the price of a veteran general would be more like it ... this can also be said for watermills and silos way overpriced compared to the vet who will make u money (adventuring)
The description has been adjusted on the latest test server, no mention of "Amortizes within 600 days (at base level)" or "Must be placed on top of a copper deposit", it does still need to be placed on a mine though (I tested it).
After thinking about it and reading else where if it is like paying off a mortgage then that means we own the building out right after 600 days. Which suggests that’s when we actually start making a profit. This still leaves me confused as to how they worked out when we make a profit since if copper ore prices fall to 1gc in 6 months then that will push back the time it takes to make a profit.
I would then also complain about using the word Amortizes, what the heck? Wouldn’t be so bad if its definition wasn't ambiguous. 'Reduced to death' doesn't sound good no matter what you’re buying. Well, maybe if printed on a weed killer bottle...
I have spent a fortune on starter packs and gems, but the price of these 2 items is plain disgusting, I am really annoyed as was planning to buy these items, maybe £20 would be a reasonable price but 20,000 gems is ridiculous.
Someone at BB really needs to take a look at the pricing structure. BB would make a lot more money if these items were reasonably priced, as I cant see many peopling buying these items at this price.
well i was thinking of buying some of those copper mines..... but at this price; which is roughly 20x the recycling plant..... hmmm guess not...
Some smart guy probably tought that the payers would pay it.... well guess again...
Wonder how much they sold already?
If 5 players buy it at £75 this equates to £375
If 20 players buy it at £20 this equates to £400 but we know a lot more players would buy this if it were cheaper, this would mean more revenue for BB.
Come on BB do the right thing, 20,000 gems is plain ridiculous, yes we know your game is free and we are thankful for that, but some of us spend a lot of money on gems, starter packs etc, and currently 20,000 gems is taking the urine.
Really gutted about this price as I was looking forward to purchasing these items.
I'll just repeat myself:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
The suggestion is that, for people who do spend money on gems, the price of the Endless Copper Mine is hugely unbalanced relative to the cost of other infinite supply items.
What does "Contains 40.000 Gems" means? I'm talking about the endless gem mine description.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BB_Azariel
And I'll repeat myself. You don't need to buy one.Quote:
Originally Posted by RawrUK
If you NEEDED the item to play the game properly, then I'd agree. But you don't need it. it's a premium feature with a premium price tag.
The discussion here is about the copper mine. Nowhere does it say the Gem Pit is an endless supply.Quote:
Originally Posted by FireKnight
At no point anywhere does the gem pit suggest it is endless. It is a pit of gems and clearly displayed it contains 40,000 of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by FireKnight
If you raise the point in reference to Azariel's quote then he is still referring to mines and i guess talking about our ability to have 3 of them. The gem pit is not called a mine. It is a pit so he is not talking about the gem pit. At least that’s the way I see it.
Edit: Tierarzt beat me to it i see :(
Its not about need it’s about want. Many want to buy it and would do so if BB stop charging insane prices. Charge a premium, sure. But £75 for 1 building? Its not even about if it’s worth it or not. The problem is £75 is a lot of money to most people, especially to spend on a web browser game all at once. There called MICROtransactions Not insanely expensive transactions! They need to think small and often, not large and very few. People complain enough as it is about free to play vs gem buying. It’s not so bad when a 10 year old can save up some money and spend £10 every couple of weeks. People who work also don’t mind spending a little to make up for them being at work and not able to play as much as they want to. But very few of the games main player base is going fork out £75 for 1 building. Its limiting who can and cant procure an advantage in game even more. And like had already been said, compared to endless devices already in the game there is no good reason to make this one 20x more expensive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
Sir... you have made your point. Repeating it 3 times does not help, particularly when you are completely ignoring the points being made back to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
We all knew we could simply not buy the mine right from the start. The point I and others have been making is that the pricing is completely out of proportion to other items of similar value within the game.
I know you want to think this is just kids whining, but it wasn't from the start and still isn't. So, unless you have something more useful to contribute than "don't buy one", I think you'll find your value to this thread is less than the value most of us are currently placing on the endless copper mine. :)
Just wondering..is this a Barclays gem mine??
Ah, it is so re-freshening, Tierarzt and his newly invented "premium thingy, premium price". Which one of those "premium" can be translated with "insane"?
That said, from other posts, we know that this Tierarzt bot is playing without gems. This is why it is not really interesting when he speculates about premiumness of price tags. While he is in one third of his posts actually helpful for the great knowledge he has about this game, the rest of his posts serves the purpose to keep everything as it is. The game is the game is the game, thou shall not question the game. I can easily imaging, that he enjoys the game as it is. You just need to throw real-life time against the maintenance problem and, voilà, game plays just nice! If anybody could throw a decent amount of gems against maintenance, Tierarzt competitive advantage would be gone. Daily struggle with copper looks more reasonable when the other option is paying 20k gems.
So it is rather "insane amount of daily maintenance or insane price tag, your choice".
That seems to sum it up quite nicely. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by ochrid
I think BB have created themselves a problem - The essence of The Settlers is to find resources, gather them and make them into other things. By even introducing the 'endless' material producers they compromise the fundamental basis of the game. Maybe they can resolve this, but I fear they have made a rod for their own back. Maybe they can balance the 'daily maintenance' players with the 'price tag' players, but my experience of other online games suggests that is unlikely - you end up favouring one or the other, even if unintentionally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tierarzt
Nobody is talking about need or want and it's totally irrelevant to this discussion.
i have played in numerous 'Free to Play' games and this is unfortunately the way things go. Micro cash items normally start cosmetic or just give a little boost as a fair price even or those with restricted disposable income. Then as the game gets more popular prices of new items start to go up and their value in giving an advantage becomes more apparent.
I can only put it down to greed on the part of the game producers, they see cash and they want more. Soon items start to appear that while they may not be 'essential' to the game give such an advantage to the cash rich players that it makes it almost impossible for the grinder and farmer to compete
Watch and see what happens once they start to introduce PvP
It's sad but it's true...
Hi Tierarzt! I think you are out of place! I usually read posts to know last news and in discussions like this (about gems' prices and similar) you say always the same think " You don't need to buy it ". Here in the forum everyone can give his/her opinion about the topic and like everyone else, you should accept it. I think that repeating hundred of times the same thing annoyes all, not only me. Please, relax!!! It seems money earned by gems go into your pockets. And read also something about Netiquette (if you don't know what it is, please find it in Google), it would be a good start for a better 'living' with all of us.
Best wishes! NellaCocci
PS: I excuse for mistakes but i'm not a mothertongue! ;)
i dont see much of an advantage gained with endless copper mine tbh not in game play nor in future pvp. If some people want to sink it into the game, good luck to em i'd say
copper mines are easy to find and build and cheap to upgrade and buff- you buy off some tedium so goo dluck to the buyers and good for all to boot as it finances the game some more to keep running.
If you look at the price compared to watermills and silos etc , then it seems hugely out of whack- but if you look at it from a different perspective it is completely balanced really.
To run a mostly maintenance free copper production chains at th ehigher level you would probably need around 2 or 3 coppermines: i.e. 40-60k gems
to run a mostly maintenance free waterflow you would need around 40 watermills - give or take a few-@ 895 gems- say around 35k gems- but much higher upgrade cost
to run a mostly free maintenance wheat production you would need around 45 silo's @ 750 once again close to that 35k mark - and once again hugely higher upgrade cost
All in all- gem for gem and convenience for convenience it makes sense, cash outlay wise it doesnt however- a few 100 for a browster game
When you put it like this I understand more why BB have put the price of the copper mines up to such levels. As you say though it’s a little irrelevant still when it’s such a large one lump sum.
They need to think about how to achieve the same price but allow us to gradually build up to spending the 20k, like we do for the watermills and silo.
Something like:
To buy the endless copper mine costs 2000gems. It then produces 1 copper every 10 mins. We can upgrade it like normal so the max result then would be 5 copper every 10 mins. But the twist would then be if we wanted to decrease the time to a normal copper mine of 3 mins then we need to buy a jolly geologist for 300gems. Once we have him in our star menu if we click on him one of his options is a button called ‘Copper mine worker’ or something like that. When we click it he becomes like a buff and our endless copper mines get highlighted. We click on one and he disappears into it never to be seen again. When we then look at the copper mine its now down to 9 mins for 1 copper or 5 if upgraded. Obviously the times would need to be worked out better so buying X geos and buying the mine in the first place = 20k gems to make it take 3 mins but I hope you see my point. If it works out the time or amount of geos would be impractical then make a new gem buying unit like ‘Copper mine worker’ that costs 900gems or something. This way we can build up to having the endless copper mine we have now but in easier more manageable payments.
This however is really only addressing the complaint of why is this 20x more expensive then the other endless things. I still think everything is still too expensive in the first place. Particularly the endless copper mine since there is still a bit of a gap between 3 endless copper mines and the 40+ mills or silos. And a number of other items provide a terrible mechanic that could be better for the cost.