The joys of pvp

Here's a suggestion for the PVP:

they'll be 2 modes: Defence and Attack

Defence: players will be able to build towers and traps and position them on their island. Towers will be visible to other players but not what or how many units they're holding. Towers will have an influence area thus protecting buildings in this area.Traps will be invisible

Attack: players will be able to send an attack to other players if they're in their level category (20's,30's etc..) generals will be sent with troops to attack and their landing zone will be along the coast. the target player will be notified of the incoming attack.
The attacker can attack buildings but if they're protected by towers or traps they will be intercepted.
If the attacker win he'll get the loot from that building. if he loses the target player will earn loot from attacker troops (bronze swords if rec, brew etc...)
can incorporate "help call" by other guild members to defend the target player as well.

Wouldn't that be a nice PVP ? :)

My troops were sitting comfortably around the fireplace when the alarms began to ring. Next my spy enters the Great Hall and warns about a huge army coming towards our city, sent by a much higher level player. Knowing we had no chance, my hero rallied the troops and fled to a wood encampment north of the city. From there, we saw the enemy destroy our carefully laid traps and plunder all our food, wood, stone and silver. Will he be satisfied?, our hero asked himself. No. Next another massive army was spotted coming towards our hideout. The enemy's spies had tracked us! He wanted to raise his kill count because of the Event, and win the Supreme Hammer of War! We fled to an allied city, owned by a player of our alliance. Big mistake! It was a trap! As soon as the gates shut, 3 enormous armies fell upon us, cutting the escape routes, destroying troops and plundering resources. The result? My city was razed, my resources lost and my hero was sacrificed in the enemy's Altar of the Gods.

I now sit licking my wounds and plotting revenge. Every dog will have his day.

Sorry absolutely not interested at all.

Instead of asking for PVP here, you might want to try playing

evony,
travian,
ikariam,
wild guns,
the godfather: five families,
kingsage,
empire craft,
empire rising,
grepolis,
kingory,
tribal wars

which I got just randomly searching the term PVP on google.

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Originally Posted by Lord_Thomas

Sorry absolutely not interested at all.

Instead of asking for PVP here, you might want to try playing

evony,
travian,
ikariam,
wild guns,
the godfather: five families,
kingsage,
empire craft,
empire rising,
grepolis,
kingory,
tribal wars

which I got just randomly searching the term PVP on google.

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Seeing how you're replying the same thing in different threads about pvp, I'll tell you this:

Those games are nothing like The Settlers Online, those games are different browser strategy games with pvp, they don't look or play like TSO at all.

What would be a helpful reply is either a reason why pvp would be bad in TSO (facts, not opinions) or suggesting games with the look and feel of TSO but with pvp.

The sequence I mentioned is taken from Game of War: Fire Age, another game I play online. And I am not asking for pvp, I get it from other online games, like the ones you mentioned. But, from what I read some times in the forum, it seems pvp WAS PROMISED in the past, which, in my opinion, would be great.

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Originally Posted by Valkran

Seeing how you're replying the same thing in different threads about pvp, I'll tell you this:

Those games are nothing like The Settlers Online, those games are different browser strategy games with pvp, they don't look or play like TSO at all.

What would be a helpful reply is either a reason why pvp would be bad in TSO (facts, not opinions) or suggesting games with the look and feel of TSO but with pvp.

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Apparently you do not seem to understand my subtle reply. Let me do this another way,

You do not go into a vegan store and request for a sizzling beef steak, instead you would go to a steak house in real life.

Why would you do the same here, by requesting for PvP in a game about trading and building, where there are plenty of PvP games out on the web.

If I wanted PvP I would have stayed with Evony or Tribal Wars.

Stop trying to make TSO into another cookie cutter PvP.

Agreed. I knew what TSO was about when I joined. Again, I am not asking for pvp, but it would be great.

Speaking of which, let me check if my Spear-throwers are finished, I need to attack my neighbour and steal his resources, while their troops are away.

Threads Merged - minion79

There are only 2 facts about PvP in TSO. 1 it's in the pipeline, 2 They can't attack your island.

Wouldn't like this at all. It would turn into another one of those: lvl 50 farms lvl 30 or below all the time and they wouldn't be able to do a thing back. Perfect way to get beginners and casuals to quit within a week or 4. And don't say it wouldn't. Just look at all those other games mentioned above. 99% sign up get strong and interesting enough to become someone's exp/resource farm and goodbye! Can barely play anymore because you get farmed 24/7. Gold is already scarce for a lvl 30-40 so losing it everyday to some lvl 50 with 10K units while you can barely scrape together say 1-2K yeah not going to work. I actually played this game because of the lack of PvP. And if PvP is introduced they would have to make it so it doesn't turn people into farms for others for me to want to continue playing it.

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Originally Posted by Dorotheus

There are only 2 facts about PvP in TSO. 1 it's in the pipeline, 2 They can't attack your island.

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You missed the third - Likely to never happen LMAo ;)

PvP will be implemented once they've figured out how to make it about collectibles:p

Alrighty, here's a solution for those who think it's not a good idea or those who don't want their island to be raged by the 'crazy 50's' (fair enough) :)
there will be a list of PVP similar to 'Guild list' kinda thing.. anyone will be able to put him/herself on the list - players on the PVP list will be player who are interested in this aspect of the game (attack and defend) there can even be guilds within this list.. you can even make more friends.

Come on guys we can't let things stagnate for too long ...! Go Go Go ! :))

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Originally Posted by Lord_Thomas

Apparently you do not seem to understand my subtle reply. Let me do this another way,

You do not go into a vegan store and request for a sizzling beef steak, instead you would go to a steak house in real life.

Why would you do the same here, by requesting for PvP in a game about trading and building, where there are plenty of PvP games out on the web.

If I wanted PvP I would have stayed with Evony or Tribal Wars.

Stop trying to make TSO into another cookie cutter PvP.

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When I first joined TSO there was a lot of talk about PvP by Players and BB (Developers Diary) It was clear then it was coming. Our Buildings had (non working repair option) and there was a 'Help' flare to send to friends (also non working). This is actually something I wanted to see though i love the building element of the game and I started investing heavily into the game time, setting up a guild, buying gems. I have been extremely disappointed that an element of PvP has not yet been implemented and I am sure many others feel the same. So this was not meant to be a 'vegan store' and as far as I am aware they are working on their 'meat recipes'

if u read my earIier posts on this subject { if they decide to foIIow my exampIe} then i doubt u couId argue about pvp coming as it wouId not affect you if u didnt want to take part

1. pIayers are not named in battIes {or an option for that}
2. home isIands are safe
3. its optionaI
4. pIayers are matched thru their IvIs
5. u dont Iose any res/settIers {so wiII not affect the market}
6. winner gets fuII xp/star coins Ioser gets haIf

think this wouId make everyone happy, end of the day i started this game over 3yrs ago and knew settIers was a pvp game i was surprised when they said it wasnt yet but they were making pIans to bring it into game pIay yes its been a Iong time since but been toId its stiII on the tabIe so for those of you that keep saying go pIay another game maybe you shouId have found this out before u started pIaying...

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Originally Posted by imyourmum

(...)

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You've had a broken L key on your keyboard for ages, aint ya ? Hehe. :p

I am now trying to finish my Boiling Oil trap in time to fend off the soon to come attack on city. This because I ambushed a neighbour's gathering party on a quarry and killed them all. Since then, I have been spyed twice, so a counter-attack is close.

This is happening on Game of War: Fire Age. Wouldn't it be wonderful if it was at TSO? Wouldn't it be good to have, in the same game, a build game like it is now and a pvp game also? I mean, I am lv 47 and am soooooo tired of playing HLT, CLT, BK and RB over and over and over, same enemies again and again and again. How can one who is playing for 3 years, like you, imyourmum, not get fed up?

A little sizzling beef steak now, please, BB.

I played Evony for 3 months with some buddies.. We did well (chased of a top-10 player and his mates from "our" region), but got fed up because of the bully mechanism in such games.
I don't want such PvP here. I'd like to see that optional PvP BB already has announced about..

hehe yes it does need fixing :P and agree with you pIayed evony aIso :)

i got to IvI 46 then got aa guiIdy to get me IvI 50 ;) i aIso cant stand doing adventures either

Totally agree! I'm lvl 49 been playing just over a year, played most adventures and it is becoming so monotonous. Here's another suggestion for BB :

A new type of adventures : let's call them.. Mystery Adventures (or something..)

These adventures will have camps and traps with variable troops i.e. that will generate different troops every time you play the adventure. [the idea is that for every time you start the adv, you will have to plan what are the best troops to send, work out blocks on your own or best pathways, find traps... etc and all with no guide to follow blindly!]

The time limit for these adventure will short.

The rewards will be EPIC! (maybe even a certain building symbol that shows that you actually completed this M.adv)

[optional: can even randomise the location of camps]

these adv will also have difficulty grades

This way you won't be able to use any guide and you'll be actually going on a real adventure! (for a change) you will have to be strategic using the simulator and time management.

This is much more fun and a challenge than just repeating the same 'adventures' with same troops with the same guides with the same blocks with the same lootspots etc.........

+1 berno been asked servaI times each time gets my vote

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Originally Posted by Mortallicus

When I first joined TSO there was a lot of talk about PvP by Players and BB (Developers Diary) It was clear then it was coming. Our Buildings had (non working repair option) and there was a 'Help' flare to send to friends (also non working). This is actually something I wanted to see though i love the building element of the game and I started investing heavily into the game time, setting up a guild, buying gems. I have been extremely disappointed that an element of PvP has not yet been implemented and I am sure many others feel the same. So this was not meant to be a 'vegan store' and as far as I am aware they are working on their 'meat recipes'

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He forgot to do his research first, there's a reason I'm asking for facts and not opinions.

Like you said, there was talk about pvp at some point by the Developers and noone is asking for the raiding of islands and resources.. noone is even asking for forced pvp. Recommending that many games and not realizing you can have optional pvp means you should really take a good look around before you say anything.

Also, who says adding pvp would make this "another cookie cutter PvP"? That's just just another opinion.
Don't even get me started on that flawed "vegan store" analogy..

Casual PvP with opt-in is OK.
Raiding islands is NOT OK.

The day they FORCE PvP on me is the day I quit.
Seriously.

I work 70-100 hours a week, and with "work" I don't mean "Having Settlers in the browser open", but "work".
Not gonna quit my job to prevent getting raided 24/7, rather quit playing the game.

I chose TSO after leaving another MMO for EXACTLY that reason. I hate getting pillaged while I work.

yeah i Ieft evony because of same reason but im pretty sure that wont happen here :)

Been giving this a fair bit of thought over the last couple of days. My conclusion is with the current game mechanics any defender with half an ounce of common sense will be unbeatable making PvP just a resource sink for attackers with no potential gain.

Ok let's extrapolate a scenario whereby PvP is not compulsory and is based on a separate island which will not affect your home island.

Assume the following:-

Level 50 player has 5000 troops
Level 40 player has 2000 troops
Level 20 player has 500 troops

Also assume that

Level 50 player has 4 times the resources of a level 40 player
Level 40 player has 8 times the resources of a level 20 player
that means the Level 50 player has 12 times the resources of a level 20 player

And then assume that there are 50 active players with 20 players at level 50, 10 players at level 40 and 20 players at level 20.

Finally assume that 50% of the active players wants to PvP

Now the scenarios.

Scenario 1

If players of equal level fight against each other. No problem both attacker and defender accepts the fight

Scenario 2

If level 50 player attacks and a level 40 player defends. 75% chance that level 40 player will accept the fight. Because the level 40 player hopes to use better tactics to win the fight. If he fails all he needs to do is ignore or decline the next fight to rebuild.

If level 40 player attacks and a level 50 player defends. 100% chance that level 50 player will accept the fight. Because the level 50 player has more resources, more troops, more generals to win the fight.

Scenario 3

If level 50 player attacks and a level 20 player defends. 25% chance or less that the level 20 player will accept.
Same goes for level 40 player versus a level 20 player. This is due to lack of resources, troops and generals to rebuild.

Vice versa if level 20 player attacks a level 50 or 40 player. 100% of acceptance by the level 50 and level 40 player. It most probably will be a sure win fight.

So,

Scenario 1, no problem at all it is a fair fight. But we are talking about 10 out of 20 players fighting PvP

Scenario 2, still no problem there is some risk and the lower level player. The pool of players is larger but still 15 players fighting PvP and there is a chance that some might drop out if they keep losing (just because they ran out of resources to rebuild)

Scenario 3, still not a problem at all. The risk will be very high but some players are crazy. The pool of PvP players raises up 25 but again some might drop out if they keep losing.

So with my very conservative assumption, sooner or later the pool of players that are PvPing will drop. What will happen next?

I predict that active PvPers will complain about the lack of people to fight and request for compulsory PvPing.

Another more farfetched prediction would be that PvPers would request that the home islands be included in PvPing and that it will be approved.

This is what I fear and what I do not want at all as I mentioned that I have had enough of PvPing from evony and other PvP games.

I apologize if my point is unclear.

Lord Thomas, I started the thread saying it would be great a pvp mode, but the day it would become compulsory I suppose I'd quit also. I like TSO because I have not to worry on my island being attacked, it's a game I can play at my leisure, skip some days if I am not in the mood. I wish for pvp to break the monotony of playing always the same adventures, some sort of battle where I would have to think a little, devise a strategy, instead of brainlessly following a guide.

i wouId never condone pvp being taken to home isIand and wouId be strongIy against it thats one thing that wouId ruin the game, main reason im for pvp coming is because of the new pIayers it wouId bring into the game {if done correctIy} which in turn wouId mean more money and who knows maybe get these bugs and other game suggestions fixed/impIemented quicker, aIso they couId buiId on the fighting side doesnt need to be Iike it is couId be compIetIy different in terms of new buiIdings that couId change how strong ur type of troop are and new troops, their are Iots of things they can do, if it doesnt affect non pvp pIayers then i dont see a probIem, just if and when they do it i wouId Iike it so both partys are for it took me a whiIe to come up with the 6 points i mentioned earIier in the post but i think that wouId at Ieast be fair 2 both partys on the subject

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Originally Posted by Dorotheus

Been giving this a fair bit of thought over the last couple of days. My conclusion is with the current game mechanics any defender with half an ounce of common sense will be unbeatable making PvP just a resource sink for attackers with no potential gain.

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Bingo!

The problem would be coming up with a set of mechanics that would work given the current layout of the game. Considering adventuring is transport & whittle you can't really apply that to a PvP scenario. Even if it were a race to the finish that would boil down to some very simple maths for who wins and loses depending on your "gear".

You could expand the base concept in a way to make it work though... You'd need new general types, probably some unlocked via PvP only and inaccessible in PvE campaigns - all of which had a subtle tree in the bookbinder to give them their top tier abilities. The simplest map I could imagine would be where you have two players, you start with a number of garrison spaces that's relative to the size of the map. You start on the top/bottom side and can move left or right to one/two camps, each of those opens up more garrison spaces but these are controlled by your generals - quatermaster excluded of course. These then lead on to three more camps facing across a river... You take your side, they take theirs - or not - and your spies, quick death wave tavern generals and the rest of your team are used to gain you an advantage ealry on. It'd take a lot more thought, and there's tons of ideas on here already that I've probably reproduced in one way or another, but it doesn't seem impossible. If you were facing a turtle, you could spy their formation and adjust if it were successful and they didn't have some kind of counter on the general at that location. Have to bring back those health packs.

I think the main point that got me interested was that you considered it a resource sink, I couldn't agree more and I think that's why it is needed... It's obvious that the economy is boom and bust but it's never reached the stage where it has popped, with everything coming in to the game the only stabilisation seems to be players cooling off, taking a break and not putting their level of resource in. That's not going to work long term because even ticking over we're pumping stuff in to the economy with the twenty or so explorers you can possibly have.

If there were a leaderboard for optional PvP with either a team vs team/guild vs guild or player versus player it would act as a resource sink. Everything that's currently being plowed in to the game economy in the way of weapons, both high and low end, would take a hit. How the playerbase reacted to that would be interesting, would they up production to cope with demand or not - who knows... The main thing is though it'd take something out of the economy even if it were introduced and there was only say a 10% take up.

People who don't want the PvP side just ignore the PvP number next to the achievement number like we do already. :o Makes no difference really if you don't care about PvP at all and there are a couple of thousand people competing for the #1 spot. Become a facilitator for PvP as well as PvE, which is essentially what some of us do now anyway when we're not sending our settlers to their death.

I'd probably become more of a facilitator than participator due to the way my map is wired, but I'd still have a bit of a go and even if it was pretty lame it couldn't be any worse than just letting this balloon inflate much more than it has already ?

nice points SpIocth main reason i said no to a Ieaderboard was hearing what aIot of ppI said why they didnt want pvp a few mods didnt Iike the idea because they feIt that it wouId create tension and arguments in g-1 etc but i personaIIy think its a good option same kinda thing as the achievement % compare thing not much difference and i dont see anyone arguing about that but anyway, we do need a res sink but some pIayers didnt think it wouId be fair to Iose troops so then market weps/bread etc wouId go up in price due to demand/shortage when they wouIdnt want to participate in pvp their fore affecting the market { i did point out that they couId seII at these new prices 2 which wouId probabIy make them more gcs but who Iisterns to me? hehe} i am against this myseIf but id rather them happy then me, but this is what we need some cIear cut decisions that both sides can agree on and hopefuIIy BB wiII take note and consider in their approach to pvp

Here's a quick summary :)
I think it has been established that most players of TSO end up being "Traders" or "adventurers"

For the Traders things will always be happening - inflations, price changes due to events new resources new stuff new players etc....
For the Adventurers something should be added to make the game a bit more exciting (I mean please, how many times can you repeat the EXACT same adv.? )

-PVP is definitely something that can potentially spice things up! And no it shouldn't be compulsory (as I mentioned in a previous reply, we can maybe have a PVP list like a guild list and people interested in this aspect of the game can be on that list)
-a New type of adventures (as also written in a previous reply) can also be a great option, adventures with variable troops and camp locations every time.

We don't want anyone to quit the game we just don't wanna make things to stagnant :)

totaIIy agree