New members and random guild invites

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07.10.16 12:54
Thejollyone

New members and random guild invites

On advice from a BB, here is a NEW suggestion about guild invites...

We all know how much this game relies on new players, not just to keep it going economy-wise, but for interesting interaction etc in chats

There has been many a post about how "noobs" get swallowed up into guilds sending random invites only to find the new player just a number, and with no actual help or guidance in the game.

And this is wrong.. Many a post has been made on how to confront this issue, and the current warning of !no recruitment in g1" has failed miserably.

I suggest that a guild invite can only be sent to a player after at least 48 hours of being befriended.

This way this new player at least has the chance of 48 hours of guidance and help from their new "friend" before deciding on whether that assistance has been enough to encourage them to join their guild.

It would prevent random invites yet promote assistance in their early stages without forcing a decision they may later regret
07.10.16 13:02
queen-vicious

+1 - I could not agree more! I often see brand new players tagged minutes after talking in G1.
I have even seen players asking what the letters attached to their name are as they have no idea that they had clicked to accept an invitation to a guild.
These same players then appear in help asking questions or in trade asking for help with their beginning quests leading me to assume they have been given no help and are just a number to a guild.
I think time to get to know people could only benefit them and hopefully lead to less newbies dropping out after a few weeks of playing
07.10.16 13:03
luigielratto

Yeah, I'd agree with that, Jolly, I know of lots of newbies who are assailed with invites minutes after first chatting on G1, and don't get chance to assess which guild to join before being pressured into a guild that isn't really useful to them.
07.10.16 15:42
Dorotheus

Agree whole heartedly with this, for too long the vampire guilds have been a thorn in BB's side preventing the flow coin into their coffers.
07.10.16 15:58
BB_Saqui

I'm keeping a close eye on this issue. I will let the thread drum up some discussion over the weekend and revisit this on Monday.

Thanks ahead of time for your feedback and suggestions regarding guild invites for new players!
07.10.16 16:13
Peccatora

Honestly I'm not sure how much that would change things. Those "vampire guilds" would just need to adapt their tactic a little bit and send a simple "hey, interested in joining a guild" to those new members on whisper and get them to click the apply button.

I think that only very few new players click a random guild invite accidentally, but rather take the first opportunity they get. They want to be in a guild, but don't really want to spend hours reading guild descriptions or talk to players to find the right one. Let's face it - most ppl who start playing are rather impatient (and that's why they often leave around level 30, things are getting slower then).

So to sum it up - without removing the apply button too nothing will change.
07.10.16 16:26
Thejollyone

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peccatora

Honestly I'm not sure how much that would change things. Those "vampire guilds" would just need to adapt their tactic a little bit and send a simple "hey, interested in joining a guild" to those new members on whisper and get them to click the apply button.

I think that only very few new players click a random guild invite accidentally, but rather take the first opportunity they get. They want to be in a guild, but don't really want to spend hours reading guild descriptions or talk to players to find the right one. Let's face it - most ppl who start playing are rather impatient (and that's why they often leave around level 30, things are getting slower then).

So to sum it up - without removing the apply button too nothing will change.

but the point is, why would anyone want to join a guild that apparently offers no help before even inviting someone? At least the person being invited would expect and receive a certain amount of help before deciding, hey yes this person in this guild has helped me before I even accept the membership...

As it stands currently, they are offered membership willy-nilly with no assistance offered in the first instance
07.10.16 16:50
lulu10093

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thejollyone

On advice from a BB, here is a NEW suggestion about guild invites...

We all know how much this game relies on new players, not just to keep it going economy-wise, but for interesting interaction etc in chats

There has been many a post about how "noobs" get swallowed up into guilds sending random invites only to find the new player just a number, and with no actual help or guidance in the game.

And this is wrong.. Many a post has been made on how to confront this issue, and the current warning of !no recruitment in g1" has failed miserably.

I suggest that a guild invite can only be sent to a player after at least 48 hours of being befriended.

This way this new player at least has the chance of 48 hours of guidance and help from their new "friend" before deciding on whether that assistance has been enough to encourage them to join their guild.

It would prevent random invites yet promote assistance in their early stages without forcing a decision they may later regret

Im not to sure how i feel about this to be honest yes i see your point the pirranah guilds that only care about numbers get them and dont care about the players just ohh i got 100 members etc rubbish

BUT not all guilds are like that. yes we see people ask to join them in G1 and more often than not they have a "tag" a few mins later and yes we do have to help others in same guilds over and over yet there is already a 24 hour cool down from swapping guilds why make it 48 hours??
there is already also the 24 hour direct trade thing unless you do it via TO at start between new guild members/friends

You know we always say to them that ask to look on forum pick one that suits them and game play and dont accept random invites etc maybe try to get to know people in global 1st see if any them would be sort of people you would wanna be in a guild with and also we always tell them or i know i do is NEVER pay to join a guild neither

but also people can join and leave guilds as they wish sticking to the 24 hour cool down rule then you get them that dont want to be in a guild that get the invites because they are tagless lol I myself ave had invites to join a guild or asked in mails would i like to even though i run one so it just shows people send random ones out

then you get them who wont accept random FR from global from the lurkers (i always do i see no harm and know you need them for quests lol)
its just a vicious circle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thejollyone

but the point is, why would anyone want to join a guild that apparently offers no help before even inviting someone? At least the person being invited would expect and receive a certain amount of help before deciding, hey yes this person in this guild has helped me before I even accept the membership...

As it stands currently, they are offered membership willy-nilly with no assistance offered in the first instance

they will only learn that after they have been in the guild and experienced it 1st hand whats not to say they get a mail/whisper promising this and that help/advice etc and they dont get it they still have the option to leave and join another one at a later date if they wanted to.

even when in guilds people fall out with each other so leave and join new ones its not as black and white as it seems as has a lot of grey areas. I know we cant name and shame the guilds that do that but people can learn who are like that just by watching "noobs" tags

When i started playing 2nd server under a different name (on purpose) i had a few guild invites and whispers and politely told them no i wasnt interested in a guild at that point even from a few that didn't contact me sent me invites i still declined to join them as im "no normal noob" but only a select few knew who i am over there. and yes i am in a guild over there now but again i still didn't join it straight away i took my time even though the lads and lass are a great bunch they a small guild i chose rather than a big one. and to be honest i would probably would not have been impressed if i had to wait a extra 2 days to join a guild if i was a proper noob that needed help/advice as its the early days most need the help the most so hence tutu guide link gets posted in G1/help etc and we can all as a community help and advised them that way and get to know the "noobs" whether they have a tag or not.
07.10.16 17:06
Thejollyone

Quote:

Originally Posted by lulu10093

yes i see your point the pirranah guilds that only care about numbers get them and dont care about the players just ohh i got 100 members etc rubbish

Its actually this bit Im on about :) My suggestion wd likely prevent it from happening so much
07.10.16 17:14
lulu10093

but also makes it harder for "noobs" though so they have to wait 48 hours as they can leave and join guilds with 24 hour cool down anyways if the guild they go in not for them in the 1st place
07.10.16 17:33
helsinki

Quote:

Originally Posted by queen-vicious

These same players then appear in help asking questions or in trade asking for help with their beginning quests leading me to assume they have been given no help and are just a number to a guild.

If a player doesn't manage the first quests, he usually cannot find guild tab either. It is even harder nowadays with these new symbols.

But I don't see how a guild would profit from a newbie guild member? If they don't find guild quest either, the guilds reward will be smaller than without the inactive member.
07.10.16 17:40
halv12

since the piranha guilds get many new members and still keep recruiting many must leave or get kicked, and since most are not heard of again ( I have many low level friends who joined guilds early - and only played 1 or 2 days ) - if they did not get enough help or would have quit even if getting the best possible help is impossible to know.
But having a 24 hour cooldown for guild invites ( playing time, time since first login, time beeing friends ( hard to measure if it is guild leader inviting and other player who is friend )) or maybe minimum level ( 17 ) for joining a guild, would give new players a possibility to get friends and find out where to get help and where not.
And if they quit before reaching that point it would save some guilds for having them as inactive members for some time :)
07.10.16 17:41
Thejollyone

Quote:

Originally Posted by helsinki

If a player doesn't manage the first quests, he usually cannot find guild tab either. It is even harder nowadays with these new symbols.

But I don't see how a guild would profit from a newbie guild member? If they don't find guild quest either, the guilds reward will be smaller than without the inactive member.

Its some (certainly not all) of the guilds that want to maintain a 100 membership that are normally at fault with this - they want to keep themselves on the front page of the guild list for some reason, but without wanting to accept and maintain responsibility for their members in my experience

Anyway - Ill refrain from posting any more and just let the general opinion have its place so BB can get a hold of whats what :)
07.10.16 19:40
Larili

I'm not a guild player ( even though I have a very busy guild of one :) ) So not really sure if I should comment, but the only real solution is to do away with guild invites all together and rely solely on applications. At least this would add a layer of the newbie being able to ask `what's in it for them' of those whispering `come and join us', rather than a click and forget situation. They then have a base line to compare the offer with reality and can move on quickly if the two don't match. ( A sticky on the relevant forum pages to this effect, also might give the newbie confidence to search out a new more helpful guild, rather than just quit thinking all guilds are as bad.
Or make the guild invite more formal with a copy posted on the forum ( for those recruiting ) for reference: ( Again so newbies can check )
Name of guild ( tag ) - leader- (officers )- current ( active) members -description of guild - time zone - rules of guild - key objectives - What newbies can expect and what is expected from them.
07.10.16 19:56
lordloocan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thejollyone

Its some (certainly not all) of the guilds that want to maintain a 100 membership that are normally at fault with this - they want to keep themselves on the front page of the guild list for some reason, but without wanting to accept and maintain responsibility for their members in my experience.

What I don't understand about these guilds is why does anyone stay in the guild? I chatted to a guy who left one recently, he says there is close to zero guild chat, there is a guild tariff for trade costs, lootspots are charged for etc and of the 99 in the guild at that time only 47 were active/live accounts. This means that everyone in those guilds is losing out in terms of daily guild coins - he was getting less there in a guild of 99 than he would in an active guild of 50! Also the lower levels are losing out to the small number of sharks who are feeding off them.

I suggested the best part of 2 years ago that there should be a minimum level for joining a guild, I suggested level 17 as by then they ae at the end of the basic quests. I also suggested that all guild joining should be done by application rather than being grabbed off g1 (Ok they could still be whispered to and asked to apply). I like the 48hr friends idea added to that. However, what I do find is that those players who can actually think and who are in poor guilds do leave them and move to ones they know will help them. We have players from many such guilds who have joined us and moved forward. If they don't have the sense to change guild then they probably aren't going to be playing after a week anyway.
08.10.16 08:24
Xibor

I was very lucky that I looked for and joined a guild that I've been happy with ever since. But I can see how some are 'bedazzled' by offers without understanding what they might be getting into - and even though they can leave, there is a down side to quit/rejoin.

Would another option be not allowing guild membership until a player is a certain level? Ensuring they have time to understand what the game is all about? It might be another way to avoid a brand new player getting taken advantage of.

Regardless, overall I would like to see some way to limit how aggressive guilds can be in recruiting brand new players.